Frustration,Frustration,Frustration!

Runnin_Man

I just came apon this website and am hoping for some good advice.  I am in my Mid 30s and have three children, who happen to be girls under the age of 7(Dear lord......please help me!)  I married my beautiful wife in 2005.  We dated for quite a few years before we got married.  8 years to be exact.  Why so long you may ask?  I was 18 at the time and she was 15.  Way to young to get serious in a relationship.  We seemed like the perfect match.  As time went by we had our ups and our downs.  In 2003 we were not getting along at all and I decided to end the relationship.  I started dating a girl from my work.  It was fun, and we had a good time, but I really was starting to regret ending my relationship with my wife.  I finally gave in and called her about six months later.  I met her at a park(she had her "boyfriend" there with her), and we talked for a bit.....awkward!!!!!!  We both decided that we made some mistakes in our relationship and wanted to try again.  We started dating again and things seemed to be getting better.  We both were getting older and a little wiser.  In Febuary of 2005 I asked her to marry me.  In August of 2005 we were married!

  The first couple years of our marriage were pretty awesome.  We did some traveling and started to settle in to our new life together.  Now, I knew my wife suffered from mild depression and was on some medication to counteract it.  What I didnt realize is how much it would affect our sex life. Our sex life was pretty good before we got married.  After.......thats the problem.  In 2007 we welcomed our first child.  She ended up having some health issues at birth which was pretty stressful on me and my wife.  But everything turned out to be OK.  She still has the same issues today, but things are looking better.  She was born with a hole in her heart that never sealed up. Its called a VSD.  We have yearly visits with our Pediatric Cardiologist to make sure everything is still good.  So far......so good.

  We didnt wait long to have our second child(me having a high sex drive, wife being on antibiotics)  oops.....  but a good oops.  Wouldnt have it any other way.  Our second girl was born a year and 2 weeks later.  They are the best of friends!  After our second daughter was born our sex life was completely gone.  My wife was just to busy taking care of the kids and by the end of the night she just wanted to go to bed.  We were having sex maybe once or twice a month! It sucked.  I just learned to live with it I guess.

  My wife is a SAHM and I work 2 jobs trying to support our children.  She is a great mom!   I will give her that.  Our kids are well taken care of and have no worries about that.  But it seemed like our marriage took a back seat.  In fact if I were to ask her today what is most important in her life it would be our children.  Despite that we had our third girl in 2010.  She is awesome and would have it any other way.

  As our kids grew older and less attached to us I was hoping we would reconnect in our marriage and maybe start having sex more frequently.  Ummmmm. no!  Between her taking care of the kids and her depression medication our sex life in pretty much non existent.  Lucky to have it once a month.  And when we do it me initiating and her reluctintly agreeing to it.  I feel guilty having sex with her as I know she is not into it at all.  I have told her how important it is for me to have physical intimacy with her and her response" Well I can go off my medication and be a bitch to you and maybe have a little more sex drive, or stay on my meds and be nice to you and have no sex drive".

  Nice choice for me to make.  I am at my wits end now.  I love my wife.  She is very attractive(ask her and shes the fattest girl on earth) and am willing to change dramaticaly to improve our marriage and  sex life.  Im afraid if I dont do something now we will end up in divorce as I will not live my life like this.  This is my last attempt to save our marriage.  Please help!

Mongrel

We can help. In the signature line is a link to "triage questions".  Fill them out completely and post here (it will take multiple posts due to word limits). The more detailed you can be, the more helpful the board can be.

Buy and read the MMSL Primer. It explains all the basics, and is an easy and fun read.

I've been working on my MAP for less than a year and have doubled my sexy times from once a month to two (or sometimes more). Still not perfect, but if you can double something...what's not to like?

Also...rule #1...don't talk about sex with her anymore. Ever. It only decreases her desire.

Mr_Brown

You're in the right spot... Lots of people here who are in the same boat... (But are in much better spots now) Do a triage, Get the primer and a gym membership! 

We can assist you in being the best you can be! And get you laid more! 

Depression and low self esteem are tough battles, don't forget in the triage to mention what medications she's on including birth control. 

Welcome! You've made a great decision to join this forum! 

maxx138

Mongrel said:

Also...rule #1...don't talk about sex with her anymore. Ever. It only decreases her desire.

Agreed. Any sex talk at this point will be a DLV. As you work on your MAP and become more attractive to her the sex will get better. Things will probably get worse before they get better and you will have to make some hard decisions. It's all worth it though 

Good luck

Runnin_Man

Thank you all so much for the response. So here it goes with our triage:

Question 1:  I am 34 and my wife is 31.  We got married in August of 2005.  We dated for 8 years.  We have three beautiful daughters, ages 7,6 and 3.  August 13 2014 will be our 9th anniversary.

I am 5'6" tall,brown hair,blue eyes.  I have worn glasses pretty much my whole life.  I weigh 165, and have a little bit of a beer belly.(I love a good beer).  Over the past few month I have started working out more, cutting out the beer and soda and have dropped 10lb.

My wife is 5'1", long brown hair, brown eyes, and weighs 130lb. She has a little bit of a belly, but she has had 3 kids. She has average size breasts also.  She also has lost about 5 pounds in the last month as we are working out together. She also has self esteem issues about her body.  She thinks she is always fat and never looks good.  Of course I totally disagree.  She doesent even want me to see her naked.  Her mom was diagnoised with anorexia when she was little.  She overcame that but has never been real happy with her body.  She was always telling my wife how fat she was and how she never looked good.  In my opinion my wife hearing that her whole life has adopted the same attitude and self image as her mom.

Question 2:  I really do not have a medical history other than I wear glasses due to a lazy eye.  I am currently on celexa 20mg daily.  I am really short tempered if I do not take my medication.  Also it calms down my sex drive, which is extremely high.

My wife was diagnoised with mild depression when she was in high school.  She is on Prozac 20mg daily.  She has gone off it a few time, but she and I noticed a diffrence when she does.  She is on birth control called Tri Legest FE.  I really dont know much about her birth control, as I am a man LOL.  She has told me that the prozac has decreased her sex drive and sometimes it is difficult for her to orgasm.

Question 3:  She is a SAHM and I work 2 jobs.  As I mentioned earlier our oldest daughter has some health issues and we usually have met her health deductible by march every year.  So we do have some added expenses out of the norm, but are able to handle them very well.  We bought a home in 2009 and live in a very quiet neighborhood with great neighbors.  We have been able to afford some upgrades to our home like new paint and granite countertops ect.  My wife is a clean freak and she likes a nice clean organized house.  We really do not have to much debt.  A car payment and a small credit card payment.  We try to keep our balances low

Question 4:  As mentioned earlier my wife is a great mom.  So good IMO she forgot about being married to me.  Her kids are her only priority.  She sometime can be very demanding on me.  When she sets her mind to it, the project gets done asap.  I on the other hand am more relaxed and do not get stressed out so easily.  I take one project at a time and try to get it done as fast as I can.  But I work 2 jobs so I do not have alot of time to do household repairs.  About  2 months after we started dating she cheated on me with one of my good friends.  That was a long time ago and I believe she learned her lesson, but it still is always in the back of my mind.  She has pretty much pointed out everyone of my flaws to me.  For instance I tend to snore.  We now sleep in diffrent rooms because of her constant complaining about keeping her awake.

On the other hand I am not perfect either.  I used to drink and party alot before we got married.  I have struggled with tobacco addiction in the past and have been caught lying to her about it.  I have apoligized whole hartedly to her, but in the back of my mind she truly has not forgiven me yet, and maybe she never will.  That was 5 years ago.  Sometimes I put my job before her, but I must sometimes to be able to afford what we have.  I know that does not make her happy as she would rather have me home to help with the kids.  Sometime I am more like a babysitter than a Dad to her. 

Sex between us is pretty dull and boring.  Always me asking, and usually her coming up with some excuse not to.  When we do its missionary, with the lights off.  No emotional connection at all.  More like her annoyed and doing it only to shut me up.  No oral sex on her as she does not like it,  No bj for me as she wont do it.  Pretty much crappy.  I am getting very resentful about it.

Question 5:  My wife had multipule partners before we started dating.  I would say 4 to be exact.  She even told me the six month we broke up she had sex with her boyfriend a few times.  Me on the other hand.  She was my first and only.  As mentioned earlier she has lost 5 pounds in the last month.  I have noticed she has been dressing up alot nicer lately and has been looking more attractive.  She even has shaved her pubic area bald which she has not done in 10 years.  I hope she is gaining a little more self confidence in herself and she sheds the pounds.  But here is the catch.  She plays an internet poker game and is able to talk and have conversations with other girls and guys.  It just makes me wonder if she is trying to impress other guys online.  I wondering if she is enjoying the attention from other guys.  She does not have a problem with me playing online with her and she tells everyone she is married to me.  But I wonder..........

Question 6:  Our sex life went downhill after our 1st child was born.  Even before we were married we were only having sex maybe once a week sometimes 2.  Again she usually didnt want it.  But now we live in a sexless marriage.

Question 7.  Sex was ok when we were dating.  She was more willing and we tried diffrent positions and had fun.  I would even get a bj every now and then.  Our wedding night we had amazing sex and both enjoyed every minute.  I believe that may have been the last.  Our sex life slowly declined until our first child was born.  Then completely gone.

Question 8.  The elephant:  Im a nice guy! All beta and no Alpha.  I just try to avoid conflict I guess.

Question 9.  She by far is the leader.  She is home more with the kids and makes more of the household decisions.  As far as money goes, its me.  I make those decisions.  But for the most part she rules the roost.

Question 10.  At the beginning of our marriage we were able to travel and go and do thing we cannot do now.  Those were the good times.  We both enjoyed each others company and looked forward to the future together.  B ut as the children were born we were spending less time together and I was working alot more. Plus our kids can be a handful and stresses my wife out to no end.  Sometimes she begs me to come home from work early to relieve her of her motherly duties.

Thank you all again for taking the time to read this and comment on my situation.  I just purchased mmsl primer and am reading it.  Wow what an eye opener.

stillasamountain

Bozo13 said:

As mentioned earlier she has lost 5 pounds in the last month.  I have noticed she has been dressing up alot nicer lately and has been looking more attractive.  She even has shaved her pubic area bald which she has not done in 10 years.  I hope she is gaining a little more self confidence in herself and she sheds the pounds.  But here is the catch.  She plays an internet poker game and is able to talk and have conversations with other girls and guys.  It just makes me wonder if she is trying to impress other guys online.  I wondering if she is enjoying the attention from other guys.  She does not have a problem with me playing online with her and she tells everyone she is married to me.  But I wonder..........

Not to threadjack this into the weeds right off the bat but I'd be wondering about that, too. You monitor her comms at all?

Mr_Brown

You need to get yourself into shape first. Then all else will begin to fall into place. You can try to fight the birth control or the antidepressants but it'll be a losing battle until she's attracted. 

If she'd be willing to switch up her depressants Wellbutrin would be the way to go, however Wellbutrin will work on depression, in my case I didn't work due to the issue being anxiety. 

Birth control the copper IUD. No hormones. 

Also you'll want to up the leading a little bit. With two jobs I imagine it's tough to get "date nights" you'll need to begin to add these into the rotation. Once a month or so? Arrange the sitter and have a plan. 

Perhaps a little recon on what's going on online. Set up some sort of keystroke monitor or something... Someone else a little more tech savvy may be able to chime in here. 

Your ultimate goal is to get your wife to have an affair... With you! 

And a little more homework... Read No More Mr Nice Guy. 

Runnin_Man

• Thank you so much for the direction and info.  Stillasamountain, I did some research tonight and some not so good news came out of it.  I look at my cell phone records and a number popped out at me only for the sole reason it was from another state and they seemed to talk  for more than 35 minutes each call.  And to really piss me off my wife is trying to hide it from me.  Every time this individual would call I would be on my night shift at work or he would call before I got home from work.  I have my entire work schedule for the year.  I crossed refrenced it. What in the hell do I do?  I found out who this person is through facebook and HE is a facebook friend of my wifes.  And met this guy on the damn casino game.  I really want to put a keylogger on her phone, but I can never get it away from her.  And she password protects it.  Things are starting to add up a little.  What would you guys do?
  

The_Dude

Sorry to hear that.  How far back do the calls go?  Also, check text messaging. Shaving probably says she's either meeting someone or sending pictures ( or planning on it). 

Serenity

Moved to 911.

Runnin_Man

The calls go back to the end of May.  My wife was actually the first one to call him.  They do not speak daily, but when they do talk it's like a hour long conversation.  The last time they talked it was an hour and a half.  Of course I was not here.  As far as text messaging no messages to that number, but I do know she has another app on her phone so she can talk to her friend in Europe.  Maybe she is using that.  If she is taking pictures it quite the surprise to me, as she is very reserved.  Or she has a lot she hasn't told me.

Changed_Man

Bozo13 said:

The calls go back to the end of May.  My wife was actually the first one to call him.  They do not speak daily, but when they do talk it's like a hour long conversation.  The last time they talked it was an hour and a half.  Of course I was not here.  As far as text messaging no messages to that number, but I do know she has another app on her phone so she can talk to her friend in Europe.  Maybe she is using that.  If she is taking pictures it quite the surprise to me, as she is very reserved.  Or she has a lot she hasn't told me.

Bro, this is at least an EA, pure and simple. You now have *a lot* of work to do.

A tough as it may be, you need to buck up, act normal, and covertly collect as much irrefutable evidence as you can. If you confront her without hard data, she deny, gaslight, rage, trickle truth, etc. you blow this up so convincingly that there's no way she can weasel her way out of it.

Folks here will walk you through it... how to collect your evidence, how to craft your A/B ultimatum, etc.

Also, now, not later, start researching a good lawyer. Shit can go south amazingly fast and having a lawyer on speed dial is prudent. FTR, we're not divorce happy here... having a lawyer on tap can save your marriage and will be the best money you ever spent.

The_Dude

What did she say about the shaving thing?  Did she mention it at all?

You want to have a solid plan before confronting her.  When this happens it is extremely typical for the spouse to deny, whitewash, etc to the point of absurdity.  If you can gather more evidence you should. If you can't get anything more detailed because it's all on a locked phone then you can just walk over pick up the phone and refuse to give it back until you get the passwords and a full explanation.  You need to have the consequences thought through first though.  Don't wing it. 

Scarlet

I'm sorry this is happening.  As others have said, she is certainly having an EA and possibly a PA.  Have you read the MMSL Primer?  There is a section on affairs that would be useful to you. 

OneEyedDrunk

Shaving her bush is way out of character based on what you described about her.  Did you at any point ask her to, or bring it up? Odd that she says she doesn't like you going down on her, and yet she shaves smooth down there. Agree with the others. Something's not adding up. Go dark, gather evidence, and come here to come up with a plan to address (I.e. A/B). 

Mr_Brown

Is the guy she's talking to married?

Adam_S

G'day @bozo13. Can I ask, why are you taking celexa right now? That's citalopram, right?

Changed_Man

@Bozo13, please tell me you haven't confronted her and blown this up yet.

No plan = disaster!

Runnin_Man

Ok, sorry it taken me so long to reply.  We are on a family vacation and have no internet.  But my youngest daughter got sick and Me and her had to come home so I could take her to the Dr.  Poor girl!    Let me see if I can answer some questions for ya.  First  thing I have NOT told her anything and dont plan on it.  I am going to take the advice from all of you

Adam: Yes Celexa is Citalophram.  Again I take 20mg daily, mostly tames my patience with the kids and calms down captain weenkie.  LOL

Mr.Brown:  As far as I can tell he is a student and is single. And I believe he is a year older than me.  But Ill have to double check.

One eyed drunk: Btw love the name!  I asked her why she decided to shave and she said she got tired to all the trimming and upkeep of having hair and it was just easier to get rid of it.  Seriously it probably been 12 years sense she shaved down there.  Big red flag.

I find myself looking back over the last few months and how blind I must have been.  To all of you...thanks!  I could not do this by myself.  I now notice the small things she does. For instance,  last night at the cabin we are staying at she tried and tried and tried to get internet service on her phone.  I kinda had to laugh a little. 

I still dont know how I am going to get access to her phone though.  We get back from our vacation on sunday and I start my night shifts on monday.  I will monitor her phone calls online and see if they have contacted each other.

Carebear

Kudos, @Bozo13‌  , for waiting. Hard evidence is what you need.  I blew up my husbands EA before it got physical. The pics and all were there. But knocking it before it turned physical is probably what saved my sanity. 

I broke into my husbands phone while he was sleeping. It took a long time. Days of researching hidden iPhone tutorials and hours to unlock it. My husband had it password protected AND jail broken to have hidden apps.  He gave the password and then I was stuck because I didn't find anything. I knew something was up and didn't give up though.  Have a plan b in place. If wife has an iPhone google SB settings tutorials so you'll know how and where to look.   Get you're ducks in a row.   You can do this. Eat, rest and try to act normal so she doesn't up and delete everything. Listen to The_dude. And stay here on mmsl. You'll need the help to blow it up and for aftercare. 

I wish I had the advice of this forum before I blew my husband's EA up. There are things I could've done differently and saved myself some heartache. It's a long road to healing as well. Be prepared to fight for your marriage. 

Runnin_Man

btw I just posted my story on TAM website hoping to get as much advice as possible.