Yeah, 50 Shades and Outlander are literally nothing alike. I've read both, kinda.
A peeked at the wiki for Outlander, and saw that a lot of bad shit was about to happen, so I stopped reading. In my head, Jamie and Claire lived happily ever after on that farm.
TPoke said: Are American women so starved for alpha that even the absolute worst asshole alpha is now the pinnacle of attraction? I get this fits with evolutionary psychology but the degree and how widespread this is still surprised me.
Historical Fiction novels aside, I think this is really the meat of your question, and is worth fleshing out a bit. It is something I have struggled with as well: women find Bad Boys more attractive than Boy Scouts, and part of what is so frustrating about that for so many men is that Bad Boys are very often amoral or downright immoral. Not to the degree where they go around raping women all the time, but moreso than a lot of Nice Guys who struggle to attract women.
It makes it hard to feel good about being an honest, straight-dealing, God fearing, hardworking dude, but it is what it is. Adopting attractive Bad Boy characteristics without actually becoming a snakey piece of shit is a hard trick to pull off.
"My advice to you is get married: if you find a good wife you'll be happy, if not, you'll become a philosopher." -Socrates
_____________________________________________________________________________ If you want us to be unapologetically feminine, be unapologetically masculine.
I've had more sexy texting (if you can call it that) regarding this subject today with the wife than I've ever had. I need to dig into this more...maybe read the books.
I think this varies from woman to women some too. My wife loves Gone With The Wind too and Rhett definitely pushed through some hard sounding "no's" in that flick, so much so that I have seen the film criticized for being pro rape. The criticism of this series sounds similar. There's gray area for a hard charging character who takes what he wants. One woman's dashing scoundrel is another's rapist (probably depending on the attraction level).
My wife being into this series is yet another indicator that I'm married to an apha junky.
I think this varies from woman to women some too. My wife loves Gone With The Wind too and Rhett definitely pushed through some hard sounding "no's" in that flick, so much so that I have seen the film criticized for being pro rape. The criticism of this series sounds similar. There's gray area for a hard charging character who takes what he wants. One woman's dashing scoundrel is another's rapist (probably depending on the attraction level).
My wife being into this series is yet another indicator that I'm married to an apha junky.
My wife doesn't seem like an alpha junkie - she has the whole Jeykell & Hyde thing where she wants us to be equals, blah, blah, blah but has VERY definite requirements that she thinks all men should meet to be considered REAL men. So I'm thinking some fun, pushing through "no's" might actually be a turn-on for her.
@Sisyphus You haven't missed it! The show is premiering on Starz this Saturday 8/9, but the first episode is already available for free online. Subsequent episodes will only be on Starz. Buy some good whisky and watch it with her.
BTW, my brother - also known as THE BEST BROTHER IN THE WHOLE HISTORY OF THE WORLD - is DVR'ing the series for me!
wow! my wife loves these books - has read them over & over - well except the new one. I had no idea they had sex scenes in them....I guess I will just have to start reading them myself.....
She will likely get the series on dvd when it comes out since we don't have cable.
@Sisyphus You haven't missed it! The show is premiering on Starz this Saturday 8/9, but the first episode is already available for free online. Subsequent episodes will only be on Starz. Buy some good whisky and watch it with her.
BTW, my brother - also known as THE BEST BROTHER IN THE WHOLE HISTORY OF THE WORLD - is DVR'ing the series for me!
She suggested via text yesterday that she'd wear petticoats and eat haggis if that's what I wanted to do Saturday night. I suggested Black Angus steaks and wearing even less...!
was drawn in by the post title. intrigued by the reviews. downloaded the book last night. couldn't put it down... geez, like I need another obsession. thanks, just thanks.
Told hubby about it. I got a raised brow queery. Did i mention he's got some Scottish in him and he's been a little obsessed with researching the history since I surprised him with a Scottish Festival ticket for his Bday. He'ld look sooooo damn sexy in a kilt.
What are the odds of getting my Italian husband to put on a kilt and talk dirty Scotsman to me?
Fugghedaboutit!!!!
Yeah, about the same as mine. I keep telling him he'd look awesome in a kilt since he's got the legs for it, but he's never going to put one on. Maybe it's the Italian genes. They're much more interested in eating a great meal and then bending DW over the table afterwards to be bothered with stuff like that.
"Anybody who believes that the way to a man's heart is through his stomach flunked geography." -Robert Byrne
"There are no ugly women, only lazy ones" -Helena Rubenstein "Sex appeal is fifty percent what you've got and fifty percent what people think you've got." -Sophia Loren
In Austria kilts are seen more and more, especially in combination with traditional Austrian leather jackets.
Apparently it's not a huge step to switch to a skirt once you are used to wearing leather trousers ;-)
_____________________________________________________________________________ If you want us to be unapologetically feminine, be unapologetically masculine.
What are the odds of getting my Italian husband to put on a kilt and talk dirty Scotsman to me?
Fugghedaboutit!!!!
Yeah, about the same as mine. I keep telling him he'd look awesome in a kilt since he's got the legs for it, but he's never going to put one on. Maybe it's the Italian genes. They're much more interested in eating a great meal and then bending DW over the table afterwards to be bothered with stuff like that.
How about a roman centurion who just conquered your village and you're his spoils of war? Surely these strapping Italian men would be interested in pillaging you ladies for an evening. No?
Well, my strapping Italian man has no problem pillaging me whenever he wants. I'm certainly not complaining. He just refuses to wear a skirt.
And as for dirty talk, well you know those Italians. They like to talk with their hands.
"Anybody who believes that the way to a man's heart is through his stomach flunked geography." -Robert Byrne
"There are no ugly women, only lazy ones" -Helena Rubenstein "Sex appeal is fifty percent what you've got and fifty percent what people think you've got." -Sophia Loren
Ditto to @HopeAndHardWork LOL. Mr. Katt doesn't do role playing. I suggested a "situation" once and he told me I could wear whatever I wanted but he wasn't putting on a costume to have sex... And the extent of dirty talk for him is giving sexual orders. Not much of a words guy in general... Unlike his wife haha
Are American women so starved for alpha that even the absolute worst asshole alpha is now the pinnacle of attraction? I get this fits with evolutionary psychology but the degree and how widespread this is still surprised me.
Don't forget about being able to leave your husband and run off consequence-free with another (more exciting?) man. Letting the female audience vicariously enjoy this scenario is the obvious point of the plot device.
Comments
Yeah, 50 Shades and Outlander are literally nothing alike. I've read both, kinda.
A peeked at the wiki for Outlander, and saw that a lot of bad shit was about to happen, so I stopped reading. In my head, Jamie and Claire lived happily ever after on that farm.
Historical Fiction novels aside, I think this is really the meat of your question, and is worth fleshing out a bit. It is something I have struggled with as well: women find Bad Boys more attractive than Boy Scouts, and part of what is so frustrating about that for so many men is that Bad Boys are very often amoral or downright immoral. Not to the degree where they go around raping women all the time, but moreso than a lot of Nice Guys who struggle to attract women.
It makes it hard to feel good about being an honest, straight-dealing, God fearing, hardworking dude, but it is what it is. Adopting attractive Bad Boy characteristics without actually becoming a snakey piece of shit is a hard trick to pull off.
"My advice to you is get married: if you find a good wife you'll be happy, if not, you'll become a philosopher." -Socrates
The Secret to Why Your Wife Doesn't Initiate; Top Two Reasons Your Husband Doesn't Want Sex; Dominance-It's Not a Bad Word; Top 10 Ways to Increase Testosterone Naturally
This x1000!
If you want us to be unapologetically feminine, be unapologetically masculine.
I've had more sexy texting (if you can call it that) regarding this subject today with the wife than I've ever had. I need to dig into this more...maybe read the books.
I think this varies from woman to women some too. My wife loves Gone With The Wind too and Rhett definitely pushed through some hard sounding "no's" in that flick, so much so that I have seen the film criticized for being pro rape. The criticism of this series sounds similar. There's gray area for a hard charging character who takes what he wants. One woman's dashing scoundrel is another's rapist (probably depending on the attraction level).
My wife being into this series is yet another indicator that I'm married to an apha junky.
My wife doesn't seem like an alpha junkie - she has the whole Jeykell & Hyde thing where she wants us to be equals, blah, blah, blah but has VERY definite requirements that she thinks all men should meet to be considered REAL men. So I'm thinking some fun, pushing through "no's" might actually be a turn-on for her.
ARRGHH SLAM! lol
Fate favors the prepared.
wow! my wife loves these books - has read them over & over - well except the new one. I had no idea they had sex scenes in them....I guess I will just have to start reading them myself.....
She will likely get the series on dvd when it comes out since we don't have cable.
She suggested via text yesterday that she'd wear petticoats and eat haggis if that's what I wanted to do Saturday night. I suggested Black Angus steaks and wearing even less...!
If anyone wants Outlander-inspired recipes for viewing nights, here ya go:
http://outlanderkitchen.com/recipe-index/
I've made several and they've all been quite good. The steak and mushroom pie is enthusiastically dh-approved.
was drawn in by the post title. intrigued by the reviews. downloaded the book last night. couldn't put it down... geez, like I need another obsession. thanks, just thanks.
Told hubby about it. I got a raised brow queery. Did i mention he's got some Scottish in him and he's been a little obsessed with researching the history since I surprised him with a Scottish Festival ticket for his Bday. He'ld look sooooo damn sexy in a kilt.
I've got good, solid Scottish legs so I think I could rock a kilt too!
What are the odds of getting my Italian husband to put on a kilt and talk dirty Scotsman to me?
Fugghedaboutit!!!!
Yeah, about the same as mine. I keep telling him he'd look awesome in a kilt since he's got the legs for it, but he's never going to put one on. Maybe it's the Italian genes. They're much more interested in eating a great meal and then bending DW over the table afterwards to be bothered with stuff like that.
"Sex appeal is fifty percent what you've got and fifty percent what people think you've got." -Sophia Loren
In Austria kilts are seen more and more, especially in combination with traditional Austrian leather jackets.
Apparently it's not a huge step to switch to a skirt once you are used to wearing leather trousers ;-)
If you want us to be unapologetically feminine, be unapologetically masculine.
Well, my strapping Italian man has no problem pillaging me whenever he wants. I'm certainly not complaining. He just refuses to wear a skirt.
And as for dirty talk, well you know those Italians. They like to talk with their hands.
"Sex appeal is fifty percent what you've got and fifty percent what people think you've got." -Sophia Loren
Ditto to @HopeAndHardWork LOL. Mr. Katt doesn't do role playing. I suggested a "situation" once and he told me I could wear whatever I wanted but he wasn't putting on a costume to have sex... And the extent of dirty talk for him is giving sexual orders. Not much of a words guy in general... Unlike his wife haha
Don't forget about being able to leave your husband and run off consequence-free with another (more exciting?) man. Letting the female audience vicariously enjoy this scenario is the obvious point of the plot device.