I have this huge resentment towards my husband

NIcky27

Hi everyone, it was just a couple of weeks ago when I discovered this forum.  I must say it is somewhat a relief to see other women with same issues as me... though it's not anything to pop champagne about.  Just like most of you I'm sure have looked at every corner of the internet for answers. Here is my story and please give me your perspectives:

Trying to make a long story short.  Sex was GREAT for the first 2 years while dating, ironically went downhill since we bought a house together, and got engaged.  Our marriage has basically been sexless, less than 12 times a year, since day 1.  Sex slowed mostly because he stopped initiating. I hardly ever initiate but also hardly ever refuse.  I've been confronting him about this issue non stop for the last 6 years.  I complain every month and have a big fight about it every 2 months.  We'd sometimes have sex once after the fight and then things will go back to the sexless normal.  

Husband claims he's not sexual.  He can easily go for a whole year without sex, and be happy, apparently. Ideally I'd like to have sex every 2-3 days.  Although everything else in our relationship is great, I hate him for neglecting me and my needs. And to be honest, the fact that he doesn't want sex turns me off. I feel like he's not a man. So even though I do want sex, I dread doing it with him.  I fantasize about cheating on him, but I'm rather shy sexually and have never acted on it.

Question One – Basic Questions

I'm 31, he's 36.  Married for 6 years, together for 9, have a 1 year old baby together. Everything else is good except for the sex. He apparently doesn't need to have sex. Like, he can easily go a year without having sex.  Ever since we've gotten married, we've been having sex less than 12 times a year. 
 

Question Two – Rule Out Medical

I have developed vaginismus.  Sex is painful and need to be taken very slowly with lubricant in order for it to work at all. However, I do not always have vaginismus.  This condition was developed about 4 years into our marriage.  The cause is unknown.  

He's had ED in his younger years but so far doesn't seem to have a problem with me.  He's main issue is low sex drive which he attributes to being tired all the time (from work and social commitments)

Question Three – Rule Out Structural Attraction Issues

I can objectively say that I'm very attractive.  I know because I do notice men breaking their necks gawking at me, talking to me, and buying me drinks, which in my case actually adds to my frustrations.  I'm 5'9" and weigh 125 lbs.  I got my body back within 3 months postpartum, flat stomach, no stretch marks.  Very long, black hair, leggy, slim build.  I am a 7 at my worse, no make up and just woke up from sleep.  I could push towards a 9 all done up if I'm your cup of tea.

He is also 5'10", weigh about 190lbs.  He's slightly over weight (big belly) but honestly that doesn't bother me. He's well dressed and well groomed for the most part.  We're both very into fashion so we're both dressed to kill most of the time.

We have no financial issues.  

Question Four – Rule Out Critical Moments and Neglect

I'm not sure if there is a critical moment but it's more like chronic neglect.  I've confronted him no less than 50 times over the years and he promised to change and work it out with me every time only to revert back after a month.  I'm starting to lose faith and really feel trapped in a cage. 

Question Five – Rule Out Outside Sexual Sources

I was a virgin when I met him.  

Question Six – When Did the Sex Go Bad?

Sex went downhill ever since we got engaged and bought a house.  Things got busy, and that was the beginning of the end.

Question Seven – What Was the Sex Like at the Start of the Relationship?

Sex was great at the start.  I was a virgin but he got me into it so fast.  We'd have sex 5-6 times a week for almost 2 years.

Question Eight – What’s the Elephant in the Room?

I now refuse his advances because I feel like he's just doing it to please me, and probably because I resent him SO MUCH I just want to refuse him.  I am not convinced that he actually wants me.  

Question Nine – Who is the Leader in your Marriage?

I am probably the leader. Husband is very laid back.  He has his moments of stubbornness when it's his way or the highway but for the most part whatever I say goes. 

Question Ten – Tell Us About the Good Times

We did and still do have fun together. We have lots of common friends together and have a very rich social life.  We also both adore our son.


So my questions are, what can I do to get over my resentment towards him and to be attracted to him again?  And how do I get him to boost his sex drive? Should I send him to this forum?  But he's not desiring sex so I don't see why he would care to "game" me since he's not motivated. 

al2682

Paging @serenity - Sounds like Low T

Welcome @nicky27.  There are things you can do, but I'll let others get into the details.

frillyfun

Seconding a testosterone test from a good anti-aging clinic.  

You mentioned that you have no outside sexual outlet, but does he?  Do you suspect any porn use or affairs?

95% of the time if you've found your way here your H either has a t-problem or is addicted to porn.  Sometimes both.

The Mindful Attraction Plan is a good book for you to read.  It sounds like your girl game is great, but there are always areas of your life to work on.  The MAP book will really help.

You can throw a copy of the MMSL Primer at him, but I'd bet internet dollars that he won't read it- at least right now.  

But the bright side is that it's fixable.  It's going to take some work on your part, but it's fixable.  If it's his t-level you should start seeing some results in about 4-6 weeks after he gets treatment.  

Welcome to the forum.  You're definitely in the right place.

Serenity

I'm not sure that what we're seeing is low T. With low T, you typically see a pattern of gradually diminishing sex, not an abrupt change like what you've experienced.

Tell me more about getting engaged. Whose idea was it to get married, who wanted to buy the house? Did he push marriage and was he enthusiastic about it?

More info about his former bouts of ED would be helpful, as well. Previous girlfriends or sexual partners?

ETA:  Also, what's his porn use like?

NIcky27

@Serenity‌ and @frillyfun‌ ;
Thank you so much for your comments.

I do not suspect any affairs or porn addiction. He looks at pictures of naked women but not so much porn movie.  He also claims that he's not masturbating.

I wouldn't say sex just dropped off the cliff over night, it sort of happened gradually over our engagement period.  Buying the house and the engagement were both pre-dominantly my idea, although he was quite receptive to it as well.  I made it very clear at the beginning of our relationship that I don't date for fun and I was looking to get married sooner rather than later.  He put a lot of thought into the proposal and were very involved with wedding planning.  We did have some financial stress during the engagement as well as first year of marriage but that problem has long been behind us.

About the ED, I don't have a lot of details but it sounded like he's had problem maintaining an erection with one of his ex during sex, and then the nerve kinda got to him and lingered onto the next sexual partner for a while.  I am not entirely sure how that was resolved. He's has 8 partners prior to me.

dalef

An emotional issue is possible as well. I know that could cause the falloff since it happened to me (male). Is he worried about the marriage? He may feel he is walking on eggshells in the marriage and worries that initiating will just set things off.

However, you have also gotten into a death spiral, with you turning him down when he does initiate; which will discourage him from initiating.

frillyfun

How much sleep are you guys getting with a LO in the house?  That first year was rough for us- it doesn't explain all of the other years, but desire definitely takes a nose-dive if you don't prioritize it.

He's looking at pics of naked women?  How regularly?  

Serenity

Pics of naked women.

More detail on this will be helpful. Is he looking on his computer? How often? How do you know?

How is your husband's general energy and motivation? 

ETA:  Basically, what we've seen on the Forum is that when a man stops having sex with his wife, roughly 95% of the time it turns out to be porn use or low T or a combination of both.

Just trying to get a feel for the most likely cause in your situation.

NIcky27

@dalef‌  @Serenity‌   @frillyfun‌ ;

Naked pictures - he looks at them on his computer.  I would say a few times a week.  They are not always naked per se, but provocative.  We share the same office so I can see the windows open on his computer.

I dont think he worried about our marriage before but I think he does a little now.

LO was difficult for the first 6 months but he's been sleeping through the night after some sleep training.  We also have help so it's not terrible.

Husband complains about being tired a lot. He has absolutely no motivation for sex but career wise he seems to be fine. He's quite successful with his career progressing in leaps and bounce ever since we got married. 

I confronted him again last night and he basically told me that lots of couples stop having sex altogether and that is more normal than I'd think. He doesn't think this is sad at all.  He admits that he has no sex drive whatsoever, and has agreed to get his testosterone tested.  It actually scared me how matter of fact he is about this and I'm so afraid that he's just bored with me.  That no matter how well I maintain myself and how beautiful I look to strangers, he's just over it.  I read on the forum that some wives that have "low sex drive" for years, went on to screw their brains out with someone new after a divorce.  Do men do that too?  

SignorePillolaRossa

NIcky27 said:

I now refuse his advances because I feel like he's just doing it to please me, and probably because I resent him SO MUCH I just want to refuse him.  I am not convinced that he actually wants me.  

sorry to read of your frustration/anger/ sadness ... you're in the right place for help

the bit i quoted, while understandable, is a choice that is working against you

i hope you can find a way to not refuse so as to start an upward spiral where sex leads to good sex leads to more good sex

WillThisWork

Hi Nicky27.  It sounds like not only are you disappointed that you are not getting sex in your marriage but also that your husband doesn't validate you with his desire. Both of these things are completely understandable, and I am sorry that you are going through this. I think it's great that he has agreed to take the test for low testosterone - that will really shed some additional light on the issue.

That said, I think one thing that you can do for yourself and your marriage is to try separate your view of yourself as much as possible from this issue.  This sounds like it might be a complicated and multi-layered problem, but I do know that one thing that can also contribute to a dynamic like this is when one person gets caught up in needing validation from another.  Many men on the forum, for example, have experienced success improving their lives and their sex lives when they stopped feeling like their wive's sexual availability validated them as men. I think basically that our partners can feel our dependence on them and this can have a heavy, negative effect on the relationship and on desire.  

No matter what you learn about your husband as you explore this further, you can only benefit from reassuring yourself of your general worth, sexiness, and lovability. So I would start there as you work towards a multi-faceted solution.

Keep us posted!

NIcky27

@SignorePillolaRossa‌ ;
@generalzod‌ ;
@WillThisWork‌ ;

Thank you for all your input.  In my head I know that it's bad that I refuse him, and I know that it's bad that sex has not been pleasurable for both of us (due to my vaginismus), but the built up anger and disappointment really gets to me a lot of times.  I could literally feel my body stiffen when he touches me, and that has almost become an instinctual reaction.  That being said, I am going to see a doctor about it since I read that this condition should be highly treatable. 

As to the getting validation part, that is a very interesting point. I would have to say there are definitely some truth to that.  I don't think I base my entire self esteem on his validation in particular, but I definitely use a lot of validation from other people in general.  That has actually been a source of motivation as well as stress for me.  In regards to my looks however, I do realize that is something that I can't have forever, and so I should not have my self esteem so heavily based on that. That is something that I am aware of, and do want to work on... but I've always see that as something independent from this issue with my husband.

Mongrel

Two things, one which will be repeated from earlier:

1)  Don't refuse initiations from him. Each time you do that, you're driving a nail in the marriage coffin.  Very bad.  Not discounting how it makes you feel, but you've got to work around that.

2)  Stop talking/arguing/confronting him about sex. It doesn't get you anywhere and it's making you look like a nag, which is a DLV (Displays Low Value). That is also turning off attraction. There's a right and wrong way to have talks about sex, but 90% of the time you need to employ STFU. The other 10% is a tricky conversation to have and you aren't ready for that yet.

Take a step back and work with us here for awhile. Remember, every time you feel the urge to talk about it, STFU. Trust us on this.

NIcky27

@Mongrel‌ ;

im intrigued as you are the first person to tell me to stop talking to him about it.  What am I supposed to do then?  I always assume that as a woman, looking hot is the sure win way to get a man into bed, and I've definitely maxed that out already.  And he's not unaware of it either, he points out men looking at me all the time.  One time at a party, he even said "I can't even leave you alone for 5 minutes.", due to men approaching me. Amongst our friends, they often joke about using my sex appeal to gain access to popular nightclubs, which I have actually done.  This is by far the greatest crushing defeat I've ever had in my life. All my life I never had to reach out for any man, and I saw myself talking to him about sex to be a huge step forward on my part.  I haven't started reading the Mindful Attraction book yet, do you think that could help my cause?

SignorePillolaRossa

yeah, Nicky ... i really think that reading the MAP book will help you alot  ... like i've said so many times before to the awesome women who come to this forum - he needs a "clue by four" to the head in the form of the primer book dropped in his lap ... you can't fix him and it seams from your words that he needs fixing ... but you can fix yourself ... make yourself the best, strongest version of yourself (which includes living with integrity that comes from not cheating) and then present him with a statement of expectations ... if he doesnt conform to the expectations after a very short period to absorb and adjust his choices, you then present him with a 'stay or go' ultimatum that you are fully ready to implement with no hesitation (meaning you consulted a lawyer, learned your options, and had papers drawn up) ... everyone around here is pro monogamous marriage, so we wish you the best in reaching him and are here for you to bounce ideas off of and get encouragement / suggestions / etc ...

but for now, for YOU, the 'stay' plan is the same as the 'go' plan ...  get fully awesome ! .... it sounds like your body/face are awesome - so good for you ... now work on your mindfullness / intentionality / communication / etc .... don't be a shrew ... work to inject positivity / playfulness / compassion / warmth into all facets of your home life and marriage ... don't overly obsess on the missing parts but rather strive to feel balance and proportionality ... 

best of luck

Serenity

I think you've got a couple of things going on here.

The fact that he doesn't want sex, is tired all the time, and has a big belly seems to suggest low T.

The fact that his sex drive turned off relatively suddenly, rather than gradually over a 10-15 year time span suggests that something else is also at play. My guess would be porn use and 'nice guy' fear of initiation.

Not turning him down for sex isn't going to really help. You may see a short-term gain from accepting lousy initiations, but it will make the situation worse in the long run. See Laid, Maid, Trayed blog post. 

Recommendations for you:

1. Stop talking to him about sex. Every time you talk without taking action, it's a DLV and simply serves to convince him that you're not going anywhere.
2. Read the MAP  book, so that you understand the Phases.
3. Figure out which phase you're in and plan your Map based on that.
4. When you feel like you have enough leverage to make it stick, request that he get a testosterone test. It's not the only factor at play here, but it makes a good starting point.

It's not unusual for a woman to have vaginismus when she's having sex with a partner to whom she's not attracted. That's not the only reason for vaginismus, of course, but based on what you've described, my guess is that it's probably a factor.

NIcky27

@Serenity‌ ;

thank you you so much for your suggestions, I'm going to start with MAP

As for the sudden drop of his libido, I think it was wedding jitters. Not in the way that he didn't  want to get married, but he's stressed out with all the responsibilities that comes with it. He came from a relatively sheltered environment where things are usually done for him.  Although he was 30 yrs old, he had no family or financial responsibilities at all prior to our engagement. I also came from similar background and being 5 yrs younger than him I probably didn't help the situation.  Thinking back there was a lot to do when we bought a new house with a wedding to plan and I leaned on him a lot. 

Mongrel

From @Serenity 's link:
"Whoever is the hottest one in the relationship controls the relationship. So if you’re groveling like a 5 before a 7, you gotta find your way to being an 8."

I'm not really getting this from reading Nicky's triage. 

NIcky27

@Mongrel‌ ;
@Serenity‌ ;

I am confused about the Laid, Maid, Trayed blog post as well.  He has actually been more of the "giver" in our relationship.  I'm starting to think maybe I'm not "beta" enough?  He calls me his princess all the time.  He does show affection, and his favourite thing to say is "If my princess wants, my princess gets." (everything except for sex, apparently) We have help so I actually hardly lift a finger with housework except for cooking dinner.  He is pretty classic "beta provider" in "red pill" terms.

frillyfun

Are his initiations weak?  What will it take for you to feel loved, and desired?  You don't have to answer it here, but it's a good question to ask yourself.

Shooting him down then complaining that you don't have sex often enough is a double bind.   My H wasn't initiating very often, so any attempt was met with positive reinforcement, but I did make him work for it in a playful way.  Don't just serve yourself up to him on a platter if he doesn't deserve that yet though.

YMMV- it can definitely be a DLV to accept weak initiations if you know he's capable of better.

I've gone so far as to A&A (agree and amplify) his initiations so he gets a better picture of what a good initiation should look like.

If he's not into sex then any initiation seems to suggest he's at least trying.  But with a long history of ups, and downs in the bedroom I can see where it could feel like you're waiting for the other shoe to drop a month later.

The MAP book is a quick read, and it beats suffering in your new found silence.  

LazyAlpha

When people here recommend to not talk about sex, they mean to stop with the arguments and discussions of the problems.  Avoid the complaints and negativity.

Talking about sex is not at all the same thing as talking sexy.