Appropriate work attire?

2

Comments

  • TemplarTemplar WashingtonSilver Member Posts: 3,371
    edited April 12
    I would not find them appropriate for my office. I forget how formal your office is and how much client interaction you have.
    I do remember back in the 90's when leggings (i.e. thicker yoga pants of varying colors) were in vogue. The ladies wore them with long tops that covered the butt. At that time, at my grad school, they were considered inappropriate for those who interacted with clients. I see them as a bit more casual than I would like at my office, still. It completely depends on how formal your office is. What are the men wearing? If ties, yoga pants are way too casual. OTOH, in my neck of the woods, I don't see checkers at the grocery store in them, women working at home depot or any of the stores I frequent. I haven't seen them in the few professional offices I go to, nor have any of my distributors come in wearing yoga pants.
    HildaCorners
  • HildaCornersHildaCorners Winter? You call *that* winter?Gold Women Posts: 3,377
    In my opinion, yoga pants without an ass-covering top is equivalent to wearing a leotard as your only top layer. Both are as revealing as you can get and still have clothes on.

    Whether this is acceptable where you work is a question only you can answer. Everyone's workplace is different. Where I live, only trampy women over 25 wear yoga pants/leggings/ski pants with a short top. Well, maybe fitness teachers will wear them to the market after work.

    I have a pair of 1990s era cross country ski pants (with stirrups) that are in good condition and very comfortable. I only wear them with sweater dresses. [Or when I'm digging out my car after a snowstorm, but I also have my down parka on.] I wouldn't dream of wearing them to work.

    When my daughter first dyed her hair crazy colors, I told her something that applies here. When you do/wear something revealing or unconventional, people will stare and some will comment negatively. If you're not comfortable with their stares/comments, don't wear/look like that. It's not in your power to change how they think.

    Enneagram 5w4.  I'm researching what that means, before designing t-shirt art about it.

    "I feel no shame in making lavish use of the strongest muscles, namely male ones (but my own strongest muscle is dedicated to the service of men - noblesse oblige). I don't begrudge men one whit of their natural advantages as long as they respect mine. I am not an unhappy pseudomale; I am female and like it that way." RAH
  • WinterWinter The Island of MisFit ToysGold Women Posts: 955
    edited April 12
    hmmm....

    I can't tell the exact style of your pants from the pictures.  But for me yoga pants are 'active wear'.  I'll wear them out shopping and to soccer games or to workout.  But I would never wear them for a client meeting or even when I go and work (I have an active job so that would so awesome if I could - how comfy).  To me yoga pants go with tshirts or tank tops - but not really office attire (although I know you don't work in a traditional office)

    I also wasn't allowed to wear them in the clinic when I was in my program at school.

    In the picture below I have the solid black slim bootcut style and regular bootcut style.  Any of the others to me are just leggings and that would absolutely not be appropriate for work unless under a dress or tunic.  



    amblrgirlKattHildaCorners
  • beribbonedberibboned caMember Posts: 359
    I haven't dealt with this problem at work because we all wear the same technically modest but actually perfect for perving uniform leotard and tights. I love my uniform. But if a man were to correct me about my clothing I would assume he was getting pleasure from the conversation and continue to wear what I liked. 
  • forestleafforestleaf At the farmGold Women Posts: 1,703
    Angeline said:
    I don't see a thing wrong with those. But neither is there anything wrong with someone who enjoys the view.
    If you look at what I wrote in my first post, I said that the man's looks are slightly disconcerting, but that he's harmless.  I don't care if he looks at me.  I DO care if he makes the statement that I and another female coworker shouldn't wear these items.  He's basically made her feel bad about wearing clothes that make her feel good.  I don't like this.

    @Winter, my style is this: http://oldnavy.gap.com/browse/product.do?userSearchText=250562&pid=250562052
    These have the boot-cut leg.  I agree that the tighter "legging" style is inappropriate (for me personally). 
  • soa2005soa2005 United statesSilver Member Posts: 631
    @forestleaf

    Regardless of what you wear, if you're an attractive woman or even just have any features / characteristics that may be attractive, then most men are going to have sexual thoughts about you. And yes, even women in burkas may show a hint of pretty eyes, or a feminine shape underneath their clothes that help men formulate a dirty thought. Clothes that hug your curves or show a little skin just make it easier for us to visualize what we were already thinking about.

    As for the male co worker who commented on it - he sounds likes a  loser for a couple of reasons. Commenting on other peoples clothing is bitchy, especially as a guy. Commenting negatively on an attractive woman wearing tight clothing is counter productive to natural male nature. I could understand if a good looking woman wore baggy clothes and this guy complained that she wasn't showing off her assets but I can't wrap my head around his complaint that you're showing too much? 


    CrashaxemaverickTennee
  • Pen_and_SwordPen_and_Sword USASilver Member Posts: 469
    soa2005 said:
    Commenting on other peoples clothing is bitchy, especially as a guy. Commenting negatively on an attractive woman wearing tight clothing is counter productive to natural male nature. I could understand if a good looking woman wore baggy clothes and this guy complained that she wasn't showing off her assets but I can't wrap my head around his complaint that you're showing too much? 
    I agree that it's bitchy. But it's not hard to understand. If he REALLY wants to focus on his work the way he should, but lacks the mental strength to do that without wandering into perv-land, it's a lot easier to blame it on the fact that @forestleaf is, um... obviously not skipping leg day - than to own his own problem.

    I said earlier that this is all about context, because if she showed up wearing a full-coverage Lands End swimsuit that looks frumpy at the beach - everyone would still agree too sexy. He's just too far down the sliding scale. :-)
    "James Bond doesn't have bad days."  - Tennee
    "The goal is to turn women on, NOT sex. If you become good at turning women on, sex can be assumed." - Tanooki
    Triage: http://marriedmansexlife.vanillaforums.com/discussion/13564/so-this-is-me
    M.A.P. - http://marriedmansexlife.vanillaforums.com/discussion/13574/pen-and-swords-map
    soa2005forestleaf
  • BlackwulfBlackwulf Leading the pack. Silver Member Posts: 1,782
    Is there not a work dress code?  
    maverickHusband3point0Templar
  • HildaCornersHildaCorners Winter? You call *that* winter?Gold Women Posts: 3,377
    edited April 13
    Lots of places are afraid to have a dress code, for fear of being politically incorrect. (blech) They worry that if the current fashions aren't allowed by the dress code, women employees are going to get upset that "the patriarchy" is denying their freedom of expression, or some other b.s.

    I have a dress code at work (retail store). It's pretty simple: black, blue or khaki pants (jeans ok), and either a white shirt with collar and company apron or a (employee purchases) company shirt. Closed shoes. I'm getting tired of the uniform so I dress up when I get the chance ... but I wouldn't dream of breaking the dress code on the job.

    The whole issue of appropriate work clothing is crazy. In the 1980s power suit culture, a woman never went bare-legged in a skirt/dress — it was unthinkable not to wear stockings/pantyhose. These days, it can be hard to find skin colored hose in a store ... women wear tights or go bare, even with business suits at job interviews. At one time, men in "shirtsleeves" were considered half-naked ... they needed to keep their waistcoat and jacket on in front of the ladies.

    We may shift to a time when the fit wear yoga pants/leotards/catsuits as work clothing   :* , and the People of Wal-Mart go to work in pajamas and fuzzy slippers  :# . Who knows?

    Enneagram 5w4.  I'm researching what that means, before designing t-shirt art about it.

    "I feel no shame in making lavish use of the strongest muscles, namely male ones (but my own strongest muscle is dedicated to the service of men - noblesse oblige). I don't begrudge men one whit of their natural advantages as long as they respect mine. I am not an unhappy pseudomale; I am female and like it that way." RAH
  • JekJek CaliforniaMember Posts: 1,520
    If he is not your husband or your boss, tell them to kick rocks.  If you really want to know what is appropriate, ask the person that signs your check.

    I would bet $100 that his wife/gf wears them and he hates it.  He doesnt like the thought of guys looking at her, the way he is looking at you, he feels threatened.

    If you were working in Tshirts and jeans for most of your life before this job, I highly doubt your current dress attire would require a formal suit
  • forestleafforestleaf At the farmGold Women Posts: 1,703
    Jek said:
    If you were working in Tshirts and jeans for most of your life before this job, I highly doubt your current dress attire would require a formal suit
    @Jek, I can see your point.  However, it's possible that even multi-million-dollar government contract-funded projects with round-the-clock security might employ folks who wear t-shirts and jeans, if they never see the public and their job gets them a bit dirty.  Theoretically-speaking.

    I put on some non-yoga black pants hesitantly this morning.  My husband then told me I should change into yoga pants.  :)
    42andatowelJek
  • forestleafforestleaf At the farmGold Women Posts: 1,703
    Let's think about the way the human body is made.  If we were all walking around naked, how would things be different?  Could men never get any work done because they'd be wanting to have sex with women all the time?  Or would they reach some steady-state where they could control it about as well as they do now?  So then put into the equation that we wear clothes.  I operate under the rule that I don't show cleavage, which is not a rule that all women follow, to be sure.  I also don't feel comfortable wearing skirts or dresses even though they are considered acceptable. It seems too flirty or something (I'm not sure). But fully-covering pants, albeit tight ones, I consider acceptable.  Apparently a male coworker of mine does not.  Where do we draw the line?

    If men are the more visual sex, and have the greater sex drive, why is it the woman's responsibility to wear fully-covering non-body-gripping clothing so as not to stir their desires?  That seems wrong.  I have a body, a female shape.  I don't see the point in purposefully concealing my femininity or my natural body.  (And this is a hypocritical statement in light of what I said about cleavage, I suppose.)

    I'll continue wearing them, I think.  I've been recommended for a more public position (this is a government job) and I might reconsider if that comes to fruition.  But otherwise, I think I'm going to keep things as they are.
    maverick
  • SerenitySerenity Senior Moderator** Posts: 11,358
    edited April 13
    Just about every culture believes in covering up the human body ... there are varying degrees, to be sure ... from African tribes where they are almost naked, to Muslim cultures where everything except the hands are covered.

    There is no right or wrong answer here. 

    In our particular culture, yoga pants are considered sexy and slightly risque in many work environments. If women routinely wore yoga pants to the office, my guess is that guys would eventually habituate to them in the same way the tribal dude habituates himself to topless women.

    Because yoga pants are not routinely worn in many environments, when you wear them, you will draw attention. It is what it is.

    You draw the line at cleavage ... the guy at your office draws the line at yoga pants. Neither of you are right or wrong.

    Why does this bother you so much?


    If men are the more visual sex, and have the greater sex drive, why is it the woman's responsibility to wear fully-covering non-body-gripping clothing so as not to stir their desires?  That seems wrong.  I have a body, a female shape.  I don't see the point in purposefully concealing my femininity or my natural body.  (And this is a hypocritical statement in light of what I said about cleavage, I suppose.)


    KattHildaCornersLeticiaPersephone
  • forestleafforestleaf At the farmGold Women Posts: 1,703
    @generalzod all of this was said (secondhand from my female coworker) in light of a sexual harassment investigation at my work that has nothing to do with me or her.  So I assume sexual, yes.  

    I don't instruct yoga, and many of my coworkers wear scrubs and lab coats.  I change into super un-sexy clothing for my procedures.  If I worked at a bank, like some folks,  I'd rethink the yoga pants.  Maybe I'll start calling them compression pants.  That's what Old Navy calls these.

    Sorry to beat a dead horse here.  Next!
  • Husband3point0Husband3point0 Gold Men Posts: 3,294
    edited April 13
    Let's think about the way the human body is made.  If we were all walking around naked, how would things be different?  Could men never get any work done because they'd be wanting to have sex with women all the time?  Or would they reach some steady-state where they could control it about as well as they do now?  
    It would be distracting. It would be difficult on team morale. It would impact client relationships. It would alter the level of professionalism in the office. It would facilitate shame and guilt for those that don't feel comfortable around nudity or even provocatively dressed one. Etc. Need I go on? I certainly can. I've been given enough HR seminars on this topic to make my eyes bleed. 

    Here's a devil's advocate question from a supervisory angle -- what would someone in the group think if the hot and most provocatively dressed girl got promoted before them? Would you want to be the boss in that scenario? The questions go on. 

    That's why smart businesses develop dress codes in the first place -- to head all of this BS off at the pass. 

    IMHO -- yoga pants are for yoga. Work pants are for work. Full disclaimer -- I am a 20+ year veteran of corporate America. I'm wearing a suit right now and have an extra one on the back of my door. That said, as mind-numbing and boring as those HR seminars can be after a while, I do agree with the basic gist of them. Apparel is one of the pieces of your corporate culture. If sexy is part of the culture, then it is. But, if it isn't, then it isn't. And, apparel should reflect that. 


    As a side note, I knew someone who worked for Playboy in their corporate HQ and they had a professional work attire dress code. Even though the guy's job was to upgrade porn servers, he still had to be dressed in non-denim pants and a button-down shirt. Ironic, but still a true story. 
    Persephone
  • forestleafforestleaf At the farmGold Women Posts: 1,703

    IMHO -- yoga pants are for yoga. Work pants are for work. Full disclaimer -- I am a 20+ year veteran of corporate America. I'm wearing a suit right now and have an extra one on the back of my door. That said, as mind-numbing and boring as those HR seminars can be after a while, I do agree with the basic gist of them. Apparel is one of the pieces of your corporate culture. If sexy is part of the culture, then it is. But, if it isn't, then it isn't. And, apparel should reflect that.
    Perhaps best to not visit the "Best Suits for an IOI" thread then, yes?  In fact, it might be best to make sure those suits fit very loosely, not well-fitted, kind of hanging on your body, so that no one can tell you work out or have any masculine characteristics.

    Just playing devil's advocate here. 
  • Husband3point0Husband3point0 Gold Men Posts: 3,294

    IMHO -- yoga pants are for yoga. Work pants are for work. Full disclaimer -- I am a 20+ year veteran of corporate America. I'm wearing a suit right now and have an extra one on the back of my door. That said, as mind-numbing and boring as those HR seminars can be after a while, I do agree with the basic gist of them. Apparel is one of the pieces of your corporate culture. If sexy is part of the culture, then it is. But, if it isn't, then it isn't. And, apparel should reflect that.
    Perhaps best to not visit the "Best Suits for an IOI" thread then, yes?  In fact, it might be best to make sure those suits fit very loosely, not well-fitted, kind of hanging on your body, so that no one can tell you work out or have any masculine characteristics.

    Just playing devil's advocate here. 
    Your example of devil's advocate seems to have incorporated a slippery slope fallacy, whereas mine was rooted in your original question. This is similar to your burqa line of reasoning earlier btw...

    There are suits that don't compromise all masculinity and look good without overly emphasizing sexuality. 

    TBH, I do have one particular pair of suit pants which are a little tight and sorta 'show off the boys' and I don't feel comfortable wearing them to work. (For reference, you cannot buy 'slim fit' suits if you run, bike and play soccer because your thighs are likely way too big for 'slim fit' pants and there's not a ton of extra room for both your balls and your inevitably large quads; something I didn't really think much about before I bought them.) I don't feel like that look really lends itself to a professional work environment. In fact, I actually did get a few IOIs at work when I first wore them and it made me feel rather uncomfortable. Not only uncomfortable for myself, but also for other people at work. 

    So, I don't wear that suit to the office. I've made a conscious choice to avoid any potential issues that might raise. Wink wink!
    AngelineKattthisisjen
  • HildaCornersHildaCorners Winter? You call *that* winter?Gold Women Posts: 3,377
    Sigh.

    Anyone in our culture can wear anything they want, anywhere they want to wear it.

    They just have to accept that if they dress/look outside of the local standards, there will be consequences. If they're prepared to deal with those consequences, fine.

    But you can't wear something outside of the accepted norm, receive the accepted consequences, then complain about getting those consequences.

    End of matter.


    Another story. Ensign Corners has beautiful long hair. When he decided to grow his hair out (at age 10), I warned him people would think he was a girl, and if he wasn't prepared for that, he should think twice about his hair. He decided he didn't mind, and ever since, he's kept a mental count of the number of people who call him female.

    He's in his mid-teens now, and with light facial hair and a strong baritone, he rarely gets to reply to "How are you ladies today" with "That's 107." (with a big smile on his face) Last time I remember was when we went into The Art of Shaving store at the mall.

    Can the Ensign wear long hair? Sure. The consequence is being addressed as a girl. He was ok with that ... if he had complained, I would have suggested he get a haircut.

    Enneagram 5w4.  I'm researching what that means, before designing t-shirt art about it.

    "I feel no shame in making lavish use of the strongest muscles, namely male ones (but my own strongest muscle is dedicated to the service of men - noblesse oblige). I don't begrudge men one whit of their natural advantages as long as they respect mine. I am not an unhappy pseudomale; I am female and like it that way." RAH
    LeticiaJellyBeanCallmeCat
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