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How to shut down the stay-at-home-princess without being perceived as a total dick

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  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    MrsB said:
     It seems to me that your wife has a huge amount of anxiety. I used to suffer with GAD, and I couldn't face driving when I first met DH (granted I had been in a bad car accident in high school , and we lived in downtown Chicago, but still). He was incredibly patient with me, and together with some of our mutual friends I got up the courage to drive. He had to sit in the passengers seat and gently prompt me. I remember frequently pulling over and telling him I couldn't go on. He would patiently take over and was never cross with me. Now, I'm totally comfortable navigating the city, including rush hour in the loop. I can tell you that there's no way I could have learned how to drive in the city if I thought he was angry with me about it. 
    That aside, you seem to really dislike your wife. Do you love her at all? Your posts are some of the most contemptuous I've ever read on this forum. Honestly, you don't seem to care about her in any way shape or form. So, my question is, what exactly could she do to make you care for her? Drive, quit smoking, never complain about anything again?

    I have never raised my voice or a hand at my wife, and always been supportive, but she decided(and has said) that she can't drive with me because she "knows" that I'd yell at her.  She has never given me a chance to even try to help her drive. 

    She needs to TRY to follow through with her promises of driving,  quitting smoking, and becoming a more positive person. I never said she wasn't allowed to complain about anything, it's just extremely off -putting when she complains about "just being a maid and a babysitter" because I'm not helping enough around the house or not able to take the family out to do something fun. 

    You all have it right, though.  I'm EXTREMELY resentful that I held up my end of an OVERT (informal, but indeed verbal) contract on taking her away from the negativity she claimed was bringing her down. I do want to fix this,  and I while she can be pleasant to be around, these issues are always looming in the background. 
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    Scarlet said:
    This is a tough one.  The trouble is that the two of you met in your early 20s and her early 30s.  Neither of you were functional adults.  You married and made a baby.  Now you're becoming reasonably functional and she is not.

    Well, the truth is she just may never become a functional adult.  Something is deeply wrong with a 32 year old woman who is seriously dating a 22 year old man.  For that matter, there is something deeply wrong with a 22 year old man who is seriously dating a 32 year old woman.  It's just that the young man's changes of getting it together later on, are a lot better.  

    You have to become a "got your shit together" kind of guy no matter what she does.  That's really the key to it all - your emotions and actions cannot be dependent upon her.  Metaphorically, you build a boat and sail it down your river of choice, and she either comes along or not.

    How's your fitness level?  How's your diet?  How's your porn use?  In your triage you mentioned some pretty significant sexual dysfunction.  Has that resolved?  Are you sure? 
    I'm relatively fit and healthy, and stay away from most junk foods and soda. I've all but speed 5'9" and 153lbs. I'm mostly toned with minor love handles that are difficult to get rid of. My inability to ejaculate hasn't been a problem since before we got married.  Porn use occurs about 3-4 times a week, with spells of no use for 1-2 weeks at a time.  I can honestly say that I would rather have sex with my wife,  but I get a "hating you with my vagina" vibe most times.

    I set out the new pajamas that she recently bought for her to wear one night and she looked at me and said "really? Ugh" as though I asked her to go out and pull weeds. I A&A'd and told her she didn't have to wear anything if she doesn't want to (with a big grin). We had sex and she seemed to enjoy it,  but the "ugh,  do we HAVE to do this? " with a partially furrowed brow becomes.... a little hurtful.  I will say that I am completely OI when it comes to bedroom matters. 

  • dalefdalef Silver Member Posts: 1,963
    My aunt learned to drive after seeing her widowed MIL (my grandmother) stuck at home dependent on her children to take her places. Maybe bring that possibility up.
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    I get home today after running calls for 4 hours, my wife,  who hasn't spoken to me since last night to tell me my son was still up if I wanted to see him,  is still in her pajamas and cleaning up the high chair tray after feeding my son lunch. She goes and sits on the couch,  I get changed into normal clothes, come out and am about to take my son outside to play.  I look at her and say - "you want to go take a shower, get dressed and we can make a grocery list and go shopping?" She shakes her head no. I say - "no?  OK" ( no mean-ness, just a "oh you don't want to do that? Ok" tone ) and I take my son outside for a minute, then decide that I'd rather take him to the indoor bouncy house place a few miles away. I got him home just in time for nap. 

    If she keeps up this attitude through tomorrow, I'm tempted to go to the store myself to pick up the very basic things to feed my son and some fruits and veggies, and then refusing to go back during the week. I'll make sure there's food to be eaten, mind you, but it won't be thoughtfully planned out meals. 

    What else could I do??? What can you do when your spouse is willing to cut her nose to spite her face? 

    I realize you're all seeing this seething anger in my posts. Keep in mind that the negativity will be amplified since I'm explaining the behaviors that i want to stop/ prevent, and after already experiencing the situations, typing them out all over again isn't a feel-good situation. I honestly do want to try to get this marriage to work.
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    Husband3point0 said:
    Are you sure you went through NMMNG?  What were the results of exercises say... 12-23? Pick a few highlights and post them. 

    You clearly have a lot of rage, but I'm not seeing how you're actually leveraging that into action by trying to effectuate any sort of meaningful long-term change. There's a lot of seething undertones to your posts. 
    I had to look up the exercises, but I have stopped doing things like getting her a cup of coffee in the morning when she gets out of bed, and playfully refuse to get up and refill her wine glass when we're sitting on the couch. 

    I've completely stopped the situation where she'd ask me to go to the store down the street to pick up cigarettes, AFTER I already came home from work.  In fact, currently,  the only time she gets cigarettes right now is if she's at the grocery store with me or if she walks to the store herself.  I'm going to move ahead with the plan to only let her buy cigarettes if she physically walks down to the store herself. 

    My absolute fear of failure that kept me from succeeding in life was overcome by making a huge career change and buying a house with her. Our income was basically cut in half for the first 2 years. Now it's slightly more than what our combined income was when we first married. As I said earlier,  I'm willing to put in the work for the marriage,  but I wasn't sure how to go about some of these interactions concerning certain grievances.

    I have honestly been nothing but encouraging to behaviors of hers that indicate a step towards more independence. I didn't actively plan on marrying a 37 year old who would be perpetually dependent.  I liked her because she honestly seemed to have her shit together, aside from driving, when we met. She also encouraged me to follow my passion and get into HVAC. We were both supposed to grow together. 

    By the way, I have always been attracted to older women,  because the girls I encountered that were my age all seemed immature and entitled. Ironic,  eh? 
    Angeline
  • frillyfunfrillyfun East PodunkGold Women Posts: 3,386
    edited June 4
    I wouldn't go to the store if she won't get off her ass.  She can deal with the consequences this week.

    Or use this as an opportunity to change the routine.  We grocery shop on Thursdays and make it into a family date night.
    Cowboy
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94


    And FFS, figure out some dopamine activities with her on the weekend.  If the highlight of her week as a SAHM is to go shopping with you on the weekends (the same old same old every fn weekend? :open_mouth: ) , well that just oozes "sexy man", don't it?  :flushed:
    I promise that if the weekend were not filled  with chores and necessary errands,  we would be doing many more fun things, and I could be more productive with house projects,  too. 

    I need to get everyone moving a lot earlier I think. 
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    MrsB said:
    Ok, there are two things your wife needs to do.
    1) quit smoking
    2) learn to drive again. 
    The smoking thing is obvious. She's a cancer survivor and she needs health insurance. BTW, has she had that biopsy on her breast yet? Tell her she must quit smoking in order to get cheaper health insurance. This is non negotiable.
    Until she gets her drivers lisence your mom can go grocery shopping with her. You don't have to do that for her. 
    Honestly, beyond that, I'm not seeing any major issues with your wife. She cooks, cleans, keeps the baby healthy no? As far as getting mad when you come home late, well, most spouses would be annoyed by that. Being home with a little one is lonely. 
    one thing I would challenge you to do is recognize the positive contributions your wife makes to the household instead of the negative ones. Focus on the little things she does. I think you'll find that if you have a better attitude towards her, she'll be more responsive and positive towards you. She's been through a lot in the last few years (cancer, NICU baby etc) and it seems that she's had a pretty horrible childhood what with sexual abuse and an abusive father. Not saying that she shouldn't quit smoking and learn how to drive, but maybe a little compassion for her would help.  
    She goes in for her checkup on the 13th. 

    Just for the record, what irks me the most is that she diminishes what EYE do around the house and at my job. As if I'm a jerk for working while she had to change X amount of poopy diapers,  and for it to be fair I should have changed half of those. 

    But you're right, if she took care of the smoking and driving,  I'd be ecstatic. I mean that wholeheartedly. It would make me believe that she is interested in making OUR life better, rather than complain how I don't make her life easy enough, that she's vested in the relationship. 
    Patience
  • frillyfunfrillyfun East PodunkGold Women Posts: 3,386
    Do you know what her love language is?  Is she a "words of affirmation" girl by any chance?  

    I know you don't dispute that her job is tough, but do you show appreciation for what she does do?  It takes a hell of a lot of work to keep a house clean, and a toddler tended to.

    What MrsB said is absolutely the truth.  What you pay attention to grows.  If you focus on the good you'll probably get more of it.
    forestleaf
  • Husband3point0Husband3point0 Gold Men Posts: 3,294
    Breaking Free Exercises typically have you looking at yourself. Most of your answers are still focused on your wife. Besides your virtual endless litany of "I enable her to..." struggles, what else are you trying to stop doing?

    She's got a laundry list of faults. Ok. We get it. Turn the page on that for a minute and talk about you. What do you need to do to be a better man?  What's your elixir of awesome consist of?
    AngelineMariaAdamBecker
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    frillyfun said:
    Do you know what her love language is?  Is she a "words of affirmation" girl by any chance?  

    I know you don't dispute that her job is tough, but do you show appreciation for what she does do?  It takes a hell of a lot of work to keep a house clean, and a toddler tended to.

    What MrsB said is absolutely the truth.  What you pay attention to grows.  If you focus on the good you'll probably get more of it.
    I had her pegged as a "quality time" or "acts of service" type of girl, but at this point I'm just not sure. I never even considered that she might be words of affirmation. I should re-read that book and get her to take that test.

    Here's another level to my issues. I think I've mentioned this before, but maybe not. 

    while I am making a decent amount of money currently, it's quite honestly not enough to reasonably provide health insurance without reducing our standard of living to living off of lima bean soup. So we don't have it. 

    My current job is at a perpetually small branch of a company that is 70 miles away from the main branch. It's unrealistic for me to expect substantially more money per hour, only to work more hours and/or sell goods/services that provide a small commission, but I ultimately don't believe in, thereby compromising my principals. I ultimately want to get out of residential service completely. My level of knowledge is better suited in larger commercial applications, where the goal is not to simply sell a new system. 

    The next best move for my career, so far as I can tell, would be to work on supermarket refrigeration. They will typically train guys off of the street, so it has a low enough barrier of entry, but I could shine with my knowledge and ability. The only problem is that they work A LOT of hours. I could imagine 60+ hours per week, and if I'm on call, could very well turn into 80+ hours. This would be compared to my 45-50 hours/week average with spikes of 60 occasionally. I would be on call less, as opposed to my current schedule of 2 weeks on and 2 weeks off. 

    my ultimate goal is to own my own business, and this type of work would give me the experience and capital-building potential that could allow it to happen. Or I could just find myself happy working for someone else. Who knows. 

    I digress. The bottom line is; the money is out there, it's needed to provide for my family, and it's something I enjoy doing. The concern is how this aspect will affect my marriage. I think there are at least a few members here who work even more hours than that on average, and even ones who travel for work quite often. While I wouldn't be traveling, there will be some odd hours worked.

    I'm concerned that it will all be for nothing. That I'll simply turn into an empty chair at the dinner table. Nothing more than a weekly paycheck that I am unable to enjoy with my family. It feels like any move I make will turn into a losing one. 
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    Husband3point0 said:
    Breaking Free Exercises typically have you looking at yourself. Most of your answers are still focused on your wife. Besides your virtual endless litany of "I enable her to..." struggles, what else are you trying to stop doing?

    She's got a laundry list of faults. Ok. We get it. Turn the page on that for a minute and talk about you. What do you need to do to be a better man?  What's your elixir of awesome consist of?
    I enjoy solving problems. building things. fixing things. Save for a few things that I simply don't have the equipment for - our bank account has never suffered a "repair bill" from a carpenter, plumber, electrician, or heaven forbid an HVAC repair man. I am proud that I will be able to teach my son these same skills. I want to be the encyclopedia of knowledge and skill for my son that my father was to me. 

    to be a better man, I need to "captain up" and lead my family. I need to set aside time for projects around the house and to have fun with my family. I'm simply spread too thin as it is. to do this - I need to manage my family's time as a whole. 

    I really don't know what else to say about that. I feel I need to get a handle on the enabling thing to make any real progress elsewhere. 
  • frillyfunfrillyfun East PodunkGold Women Posts: 3,386
    You're good with your hands, and can fix stuff....that's a tremendous skill set.  You're not going to solve the time vs. money thing right away, but I'll put this thought into your head to marinate:
    $100 (an hour) x 20 hours a week x 50 weeks a year= $100,000 a year

    My mechanic bills at $60.  Ponder my formula for a while, and see if anything enlightening pops up.
    [Deleted User]
  • SchaeferSchaefer FloridaMember Posts: 94
    edited June 5
    Kiche said:
    Schaefer said:

    Just for the record, what irks me the most is that she diminishes what EYE do around the house and at my job. As if I'm a jerk for working while she had to change X amount of poopy diapers,  and for it to be fair I should have changed half of those. 


    Be careful you're not getting stuck in a martyr standoff here (been there, done that. Trust me, nobody wins :/)

    You have a unique skill set - do you have 'official' trade certification? In Canada you would have your 'Red Seal' which opens many doors. Commercial work always pays better than residential - and better hours too. Can you leverage your skills/knowledge into taking on a partner/capable apprentice who needs the hours and has time/energy to work on call? (Pretty sure here there's gov't incentives for entrepreneurs/hiring apprentices to tap into too.)

    Besides supermarkets, are there other commercial opportunities if you had your own biz? DS works in restaurants and has mentioned there's always issues with getting timely/affordable/reliable/quality service...

    And one other thing, if you're working crazy hours and stretched so thin, maybe you need to rethink your current housing? So your wife won't drive and the house needs a lot of time and $$$, neither of which you have the energy for. Are there better alternatives out there?

    Believe me, I'm not getting into a martyr situation. I never complain to her about my job. I just become dumbfounded when she makes a "you need to do this" comment when I walk in the door soaked in sweat. 

    I will be officially eligible to apply for a contractor's license around October. It's not a realistic option this soon. 

    It's not so much that the house needs a ton of work,  it's just a lot of little things and one big thing (our kitchen has blue 4"x4" tile for the countertops and could stand to be rearranged for better functionality) it's more that right now my free time is inconveniently  scattered throughout the day.  If I could consistently carve out 2-3 hours a week I would be a much more productive person.  Likewise,  if I was able to get the grocery shopping/cleaning done without my intervention,  I would be able to free up a tremendous amount of time for family fun. 

    Ah,  we're back to angry wife. 

    I have to go on a service call this morning,  so she comes out of our bedroom, tosses her ipad on the couch and says " great,  so now I have him all day and I also have to try cleaning the house. That's fucking fantastic."

    I just stare blankly at her and go back to drinking my coffee. When I get home,  I'll mow the lawn and then see if she'll make a grocery list with me today and go shopping. I will not go shopping without a list from now on. If she pulls the same thing as yesterday,  so be it. No X until Y

    If she still has the same shitty attitude upon my return,  I don't think I should help clean the house if there's anything left.  What do you think? 
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