Vanquishing Vampires - Am I Doing This Right

mrsthing

I have identified two vampires in my life that I had no idea fit this criteria.  One is a close male friend of 25+ years who has a drinking and drug problem.  He has been growing angrier and angrier and exhibited especially bad behavior over the Xmas holidays (bordering on physical violence, screaming, calling me names).  My husband brought him to a hotel b/c he was acting out so much and we have not seen him since.  He tried apologizing but I told him the only way I wanted him in my life is if I stopped drinking and got help. I have asked him to do this many times before too and he just yelled at me. He refused this time too, and we have not spoken since.   This is the person who walked me down the aisle at my wedding, we were very close.  I feel terrible about the fact that I don't miss him at all.

The other vampire is a close friend of 18 years who I recently was planning to start a business with.  This friend lost her job a few years ago, has been very very depressed and won't get help for depression despite my and others urging.  She is also always physically sick and was too sick (her back hurt, her hand hurt, her toe hurt etc. - nothing really debilitating) to work on our business all the time so I severed our business relationship less than 2 weeks ago b/c she was not doing any work on the business for almost 2 years and I had been.  

She says how important the friendship is but I am so tired of her. All she does is complain about everything.  She is so negative and angry that I dread seeing her and speaking to her. I am even getting annoyed writing this. I cancel any plans we make, feigning illness or work obligations. 

I guess my question is - do I just cut them both out of my life for good?  I think I know the answer, but how do I go about this with the second person, who is easily hurt and VERY depressed?

Angeline

You've said your piece on what she needs to do to remain in your life (get help, stop whining and fix the causes of the negativity). Unless you were so vague or wishy washy the point didn't get across, in which case have that conversation, and she may take herself out if your life.

Stop making excuses (feigning work or illness), because that just kicks the can down the road of really dealing with her.

"Friendships should lift BOTH people up. I'm tired of bringing all the positive energy to this friendship."

Athol_Kay

Vampires never get help while victims carry them.

Honestly sometimes you just have to tell them to fuck off and not give a crap about their feelings.

mrsthing

Thanks for the feedback.  I know this is all good stuff and that it is part of the process of my MAP and overall growth. My therapist told me last week that I am 100% not seeing myself as a victim anymore and I am aware that I don't have to tolerate anyone treating me in any way I don't want.  It's just such a change from being a doormat for over 40 years.  And a little scary b/c I expect other vampires may surface and that they will be old friends b/c once upon a time I didn't value myself much.

Years ago I cut a college friend who was a horrible vampire loose.  She has a severe mental illness so I kept her in my life for years using that as an excuse, but we naturally grew apart.  She recently resurfaced and I am not going anywhere near that drama.

I was really clear with my female friend that she needed to get help for the depression, that I can't stand whining and that she is just plain not easy or fun to be with.  All of my other friends and my husband cannot stand her negativity, so why should I be any different?

I will stop making excuses though.  If she tries to make plans or calls and is being negative, I will simply reiterate my displeasure with her behavior and let her know that I don't want to be around it.

mrsthing

So today I had a discussion with my female vampire friend and reiterated that I am basically not enjoying all the negativity. She turned around and told me that I am not only negative, but oversensitive (pot, meet kettle, projection much?). She also hurt me in the past when I tried to talk to her about the issued with my husband's ASD diagnosis, telling me I was seeking to make problems where there were none.

Friendship over officially until the negativity ends, probably never unfortunately.

Tennee

The Awesome is not because of your loss of a friendship; its because vampires need slaying...

EANx

I recently severed a relationship with someone from Jr. High. She had gradually become more of an extreme feminist and social-justice warrior, blaming everything but her own poor decision-making for her situation. (Choosing to get a master's degree in education from a private university, entirely on loans then accepting a job as an elementary school teacher, buying a home at the height of the market in a remote area, etc). We finally stopped talking after she complained about a reference I made to "a girl at work" that turned into a disagreement about "privilege" (I've had far more success than she has, all through hard work). That she was the privileged one when we were growing up was lost on her.

My mantra has become, would I want to be friends with this person if we met today? If that's not attractive, why do I keep them around?

mrsthing

@EANx the "would I be friends with this person today?" is a great guideline. In the case of my most recent vampire, no, I'd never be friends with her if I met her right now.  I'd find her whiny.  She's from a privileged background too and I'm not, but she has often said to me how everything comes to me with very little work.  Not so, and even if that were true, why are you saying that?

She also (and I cringe to even share this) accused me many years ago of stealing money from her apartment.  She was going through a breakup, so the irrational behavior I attributed to the breakup.  I was struggling finacially at the time but I'd never steal from anyone.  She actually attributed it to not only my financial struggle but the fact that I grew up poor and was therefore capable of such an action. But in retrospect, why did I forgive someone who accused me of stealing?  Ugh, I can't believe myself sometimes! 

I have a lot of social justice warrior folks as buddies.  All of them are suffering financially.  But no complaints from anyone, they all love their work - I just know they struggle with loans etc.  I buy a lot of lunches and drinks despite their objections.

One friend I have has made some pretty bad life choices, is suffering financially and has a very tough time of it in general.  I won't go into it but she's been very sick (life threatening chronic illness but now recovered - twice), her kids have been very sick, she has no money and works like a dog and her H can't work.  This girl never complains and goes through life smiling.  Yet she's positive and fun to be with.

mrsthing

Oh and @Tennee - my new user name will be @Buffy.  Vampire Slayer is here.

mrsthing

Hi everyone,  I have never discussed this but it has been a big issue between my H and I - and it is something I am ready to examine (I don't think I was before).  The issue is the possibility of my extended family being vampires. 

The backstory is that I was abused as a kid by my parents- if you follow me you know the extent of this but for those who don't - the worst of it is that I was raped by my stepdad and he abused me sexually and my mom didn't do anything for over 10 years - except took me to the doctor when she thought he had gotten me pregnant (which thank goodness didn't happen). My mom told me I had to do what he told me sometimes and denied it the rest of the time. Then when she left him, she told me it was my fault, that  stole her husband and kicked me out at 16 because she was afraid I'd steal her new boyfriend, and cut off financial support then too.  There were many other bad things too, to me these are the worst to me.

The backstory with my extended family is that they refused to take me in or help in any way at this time.  My mom told them some lies about me I found out later and they believed her.  Still, I can't understand why they didn't intervene somehow.  Anyway, I can forgive this part.

Here's the part that bothers me: my mom continued to be abusive for years (lied, cursed at me over the phone, stole money etc.) so I cut contact with her a few years ago.  My extended family knows about her behavior and most of the abuse I suffered as a child, they think my mom is BSC but they remain in contact with her.  I have told my family that I find this contact with my mom hurtful to me and that I think it is wrong.  For several years they pushed me to resume contact with her and I severed my relationship with them too until they promised to stop demanding this of me.  So I took them back into my life in a limited way. 

My cousin got married a few years ago.  I have always had a nice relationship with him but then I found out that my mom was invited to his wedding and we were excluded.  That was really a big blow to me and I let him know.  He just said his mom made him handle it this way - but he's a grown man.  He could have stood up for me but he chose not to.

The thing is...I am really bothered that they remain in contact with my mom.  My H thinks I should sever contact with them too.  I am wondering what the forum thinks of this.  I kind of feel that it is the right thing but I am unsure. Are they vampires?

Rorschach

If it's draining energy from you, of no benefit to you or anyone you care about, and generally a negative, then cut 'em loose and move on. You owe them nothing.

mrsthing

@Rorschach as much as I hate to admit it, what you are saying does indeed apply to my extended family.  I think I knew that already.  It hurts that no one in my family stands up for me ever. I just feel bad about cutting so many people off.  It makes me feel like the things my mom told my family (that I was a drug addict etc.) will be thought of as true. But why should I care?

Angeline

Are they worthy of being your jury?

mrsthing

@Angeline no, they aren't. I don't respect them very much now that I think about it. 

In my H's family, he has a cousin who behaves a lot like my mom - essentially a very dangerous abusive person.  She almost got his uncle arrested falsely among other things, but the thing with H's uncle was the most scary b/c he could have gone to jail - she falsely accused him of pointing a gun at her.  This is in my H's home country - they took his uncle's guns away for a period but he didn't end up going to jail thank goodness.

The family has since cut of all contact with her with the exception of her own mother, who in a strange (or not so strange) parallel, she stole money from her mom like my mom did steal from me. But it is just so striking how differently my H's family handled a similar situation.  This person is all but cut off from the entire family except her mom who they have urged to get her help.  When her mom didn't listen to reason, she was cut off too.

My family in contrast, sweeps everything under the rug and makes me feel like the crazy one.

Lenny

@mrsthing the family reaction sounds very familiar. 

I have an uncle who did some weird stuff, cops got involved.  Everyone, dropped him like a stone except one of his sisters. 

I have another uncle who was a drunk, did time for DUI, everyone seemed to protect him and his behavior.  Not me.  I told my immediate family I want nothing to do with him, until he is dry, I still see my cousins.  Last time I saw him, we buried him about a year ago.  I have no regrets not seeing him for about 20 years, he is not someone I want my children to see / get involved with. 

A lot of my family are not people who I would choose to be friends with.  Many of them are lazy, have no drive, live on welfare etc. Somethings they have done are just not forgivable. But there are some nice people in the mix. 

I choose along time ago to not associate with them, or let them associate with me. 

I choose recently to get back involved in a limited fashion with some of them over Christmas, and recently funerals.  My choice, on my terms.  I am now in the right frame to introduce my children to some of my family members not all. 

It is still hard not being around for events, but I think of my children now and ask myself.  Is it better for them or not. For some of my family members my children will not even know they exist.  Some skeletons need to remain buried. 

Scarlet

They are toxic people.  The fact that they are related to you does not change the fact that they are toxic.  You owe them nothing. 

A good friend and I each moved to the towns where our respective mothers live.  My mom is amazing; hers is not.  I was chatting with my friend about something my mom and I had done together, and my friend expressed guilt that she had not gone to see her mother yet.  My response is that I spend time with my mom because she is a wonderful person and I love spending time with her.  I do not spend time with her simply because we have the same smile and hair color. Her mom does not deserve the "my mom" treatment, so she need not feel guilt for not treating her mom like I treat my mom.  I now say the same to you.  These people have not earned the "awesome family" treatment so you do not have to give it to them. 

In other words, fuck 'em.

Reborn

mrsthing said:

I just feel bad about cutting so many people off.  It makes me feel like the things my mom told my family (that I was a drug addict etc.) will be thought of as true. But why should I care?

Angeline said:

Are they worthy of being your jury?

This is the key to it. They are not.

But I am wondering if, when they don't cut your mother off, you think that means they already believe those things?  You said "My extended family knows about her behavior and most of the abuse I suffered as a child, they think my mom is BSC". They may just be trying to remain on good terms with both sides. By minding that they talk to her, you are again making them your jury. 

I think you are right to put a stop to them urging you to reconcile with her. That is hurtful and unacceptable. 

But do you have a sense as to whether they really might believe you are a drug addict? How do they treat you?

mrsthing

Thank you @Lenny @Scarlet @Reborn.  This is a tough issue for me.  I am very angry.

I cannot help it vis a vis making them my jury.  I DO mind that they talk to my mom.   I would not talk to anyone that I knew abused their kid.  People who knew about my mom in my old neighborhood hate her.  One woman told me she saw us together years ago but she could not come over to say hello because she was so angry at my mom for how she treated me that she was scared she'd punch her.  Not family members mind you, just random people from the area.  They didn't know I was abused maybe but everyone knew I got kicked out of the house.  They all made me food after that.

 I especially mind that they choose her over me in social situations.

@Lenny I am so sorry you are familiar with this situation.  I think the limited contact option might be a good one for me also.

@Scarlet I am tending to agree with your take on this.  They are definitely toxic.  My H is an exceptional judge of character and he doesn't like them.

@Reborn - the drug addict thing was apparently something in the past - apparently I was a cocaine addict (whatever, I can't even put nasal spray in my nose and I don't even drink alcohol - my friends would laugh hysterically at this). 

They definitely believed it there were other things - my mom must have told them I was physically abusive to my grandmother because they told my husband I pushed her down the stairs but they forgave me for it.  Of course this never happened b/c the fact that I'd never have done that notwithstanding - where were her injuries from my apparently pushing her down a flight of stairs?  FWIW my grandmother was also abusive but not as bad as my parents by a long shot. I didn't really like her but I'd never have hurt her. He didn't believe them but he did tell me it was said and he was very upset. Not to mention why the hell are they saying this to my husband??

They treat me like someone with a f*cked up past that has gotten their life together.  And I guess it is true - I had a messed up past until I was 18 or so.  But none of that was my fault and I was not the person my mom has apparently portrayed me to be. Living on my own as a teenager I never got into drugs etc. and I was an honor student.  I went to college and excelled there too.

FWIW my mom lives in the area I grew up in and some of my childhood friends have told me very strange things she has said - including that I moved overseas due to my drug problem.  No one believes her (b/c obviously I am not overseas!) but this is the kind of thing she does.  I have never told me aunts or anyone not to believe her. 

Lenny

It was very hard for me to let go. 

I know the anger, the frustration, the sense of injustice.

Mostly I know how lonely it can feel being on the other side where there is no one to hear your side of the story and you feel like you can trust no one.  They simply do not get you.

I had to prioritize my life, my well being over family ties. 

One of the hardest things I had to do, but worth it.

After about 20 years  it is still hard. Sadly, there are people in the world who I do not want my children to meet, unfortunately some of are my family.

All I can say is find a way to let the anger go, if you don't it will consume you and taint the rest of your life. The vampires are simple not worth it. 


 

mrsthing

@Lenny I was reading over your comments and I had a thought.  Recently my cousin had a nervous breakdown - or something like this.  She had to move home with my aunt this summer, who was kind of vague about it but said that my cousin recalled some trauma from her past that she had repressed.  I have seen my cousin and b/c I have PTSD from my own past, I offered to talk to her but she told me she's fine (which I know she isn't).

I realized today that I am not angry so much at my family about me.  My cousin was also molested by my stepdad.  I walked in on it happening twice.  She is much younger than me, she had no idea what was going on and both times I was able to put a stop to it without making her upset (she was about 4). 

Now I don't know if this is what is upsetting my cousin but I suspect it is at least playing a part.  If I saw it twice that can't be it.  I am super upset b/c I could have told her mother but my stepdad threatened me so I did not.

My cousin was also in an abusive relationship years ago and one day I get a call that he beat her so bad she was in the hospital.  She was with the guy for 9 years.

So I think part of my frustration with my family is just how everything gets swept under the rug.  Surely with two girls molested (and more went on with my cousin and her own dad - her dad actually propositioned me for sex when I was a teenager and she saw it happening, so I can imagine that he's also a louse) and my other cousin who has cut off all ties with the family, they must realize there are some issues.  But no one is addressing any of it.

I really hurt for my cousin.  Much more than for myself right now. 

Winter

I am so sorry you had to go through so much.   

I've pretty much ignore most all of my family now that I'm an adult. I was molested by a family friend as a child and when I could finally tell my dad and step-mom (as an senior in high school - moved away and living with my mom) they didn't seem to care. They continued to be friends with this person. If there were family events they would 'warn' me that he was going to be there just in case I wanted to stay home instead. It was totally messed up. 

I never confronted them about it but when I was able to leave and go to college I never looked back. I speak with them maybe once a year. It actually came out later that he was molesting his own step-daughter. He went to jail for it. And they never apologized. 

People like that don't deserve a place in your life.