My Intro and Triage ... It's a fracked up life

Question One – Basic Questions

Me: 5'11", 165 Lbs, 41 Yrs, I'd consider myself an 8 (Maybe an 8.5)

Her: 4'11", Around 130 Lbs, 43 Yrs, She is about an 8 as well

Got married about 10 years ago, knew each other for 13 years, No children (I'll explain later). We both worked in the same place. I had a girlfriend at the time but we hooked up after work one day.

Question Two – Rule Out Medical

We are both in good physical health. We are both into general health and take care of our bodies and eat mostly healthily. I recently (January this year) started a serious program to get into shape. She occasionally does Yoga and meditation.

Question Three – Rule Out Structural Attraction Issues

We have always been working professionals and were in the same field when we met. About 4 months into our marriage she got into trouble at our work place and we were both suspended with her being on half pay for several years until the issue was sorted out. We also lost our house and my land paying lawyers fees. She was convicted and sent to prison which was overturned after about 4 months. She went through a depression around that time

She now has a successful business and makes good money but she takes everything and re-invest in the business leaving me to pay the majority of the bills. That sucks. We now live in a different place from when we first got married and I have a full time job that keeps me away from home about 4 nights a week. I also work 6 days a week and when I am home she is hardly around partially because of her work. We rarely see each other lately.

Question Four – Rule Out Critical Moments and Neglect

I would say that at the crucial moments in the relationship I was there but at the same time practically not there. I have had her back, stuck around when she was in trouble, and supported many of her failed business ventures. But she would always say that I disappear when things needed to get done. I can look back and say that she was right. I didn't step up when she was expecting me to and that eroded her trust.

I would end up using avoidance techniques to keep from rocking the boat and wouldn't engage when things got critical. That was after she blew up at me one night when I was attempting to initiate sex, during the legal situation. She said that she didn't want to talk about sex again. I stupidly told myself that I wouldn't initiate again until she wanted to. I have been gun shy to talk to her about sex since that time. We never really developed any vernacular for sex as she was always very hesitant to talk about sexual things. I later found out that she was molested as a child by an older cousin. She still has not opened up to me about that but is going through therapy for it now.

Question Five – Rule Out Outside Sexual Sources

At this point it is extremely difficult for me to rule out that she is having an affair. I'm out of town 4 (sometimes 5 or 6) nights a week. When I call to check on her she rushes me off the phone like she is busy so it could very well be possible. She is also away from home sometimes late at night and gives no explanation or attempt at telling me where she is going. She rarely calls and when she does it's only to find out in a round a bout way if I am coming home that night. I have never confronted her on these things so it could all be possible.

For me I live and sleep in a separate area because of work and there are several women who have shown definite signs of interest. This is especially since I started working out and have improved my physique. I've recently had one woman tell me that she could be my away from home girlfriend and another ask me if we are 'friends with benefits'. I am sure that I could sleep with probably three of them and my wife would never find out.

I'm not planning on cheating but I wonder sometimes if the reason she liked me in the first place was that I was already in a relationship when we met.

Question Six – When Did the Sex Go Bad?

I would say that about 3 years into our marriage the sex stopped completely. Partially because of my stubbornness and her inability to connect because of all the things that were going on with her case. Even when she did give me signs they all completely flew over my head. I had completely convinced myself that if she wanted sex she would say so 

It's been bad for a very long time. Honestly I'm not sure why I'm still here. The tension has always been high in our marriage as 4 months in everything exploded and our lives both changed. She was never that into fellacio and although the sex was fun I was only able to make her cum a few times. She also was never good at talking about what she liked sexually (which is all tied into her childhood trauma) and it was difficult to find out what excited her after a while.

Question Seven – What Was the Sex Like at the Start of the Relationship?

It was great when we first started and she wanted to see me every night and would be noticeably disappointed when I had other plans with my girlfriend. I guess the fact that there was another woman made her want to take me for herself. As soon as she got married to me, BOOM, very little sex. Even though we were having sex often at first she never really opened up, didn't want to talk about sexual preferences or use many sexual words. I would say that my sex drive was always higher than hers. 

Question Eight – What’s the Elephant in the Room?

My marriage is in trouble. The last time there was an opportunity for sex was about 2 year ago. But I fucked up the approach and wimped out. And the worst part is she kinda initiated it but I didn't follow through. Now we barely talk. Getting her to interact with me at all is very difficult. I don't even know where I stand anymore. She has mostly cut me out of her life at this point. Most of the time she is totally indifferent to me ... except when it's time to pay the bills.

Question Nine – Who is the Leader in your Marriage?

I was sorta the leader at first ... but because I tended to avoid conflict after the legal incident started she was forced to step up. She has made comments many times about how I am just absent when things need to get done. As a result she became the leader. The more she stepped up the further back I stepped and I realize that was the worst thing I could do.

Question Ten – Tell Us About the Good Times

This is a big problem. The vast majority of any 'Good' times were before we got married. She was exonerated from the charges at our workplace but it put emotional, financial, sexual, and physical strains on our relationship. That situation dragged out for 7 years and only recently it was put to rest but the damage was/is done. She even stayed in this country because she wanted to be with me and we talked about having kids in the early days. 

Now. Things have fundamentally changed in how she looks at life. She is just now going to therapy to deal with the molestation and has said that she needs to work on her. Her time in prison really messed with her head and she was a different person when she came out. 

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Comments

  • BlueWolfBlueWolf The grasslandsSilver Member Posts: 606

    Hi, welcome here. I feel for you, have a W with a history of sexual abuse myself. Feel free to read through my thread and triage for references. There are several others here with similar stories and all has made some serious progress even if it isn´t easy. You can change your situation and Life just don´t give up, you have come to the right Place.

    http://marriedmansexlife.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/11610/bluewolfs-map-to-become-a-captain/p1

    http://marriedmansexlife.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/11588/triage-messy-as-they-come/p1

    "The male lion doesn't get pissy." Tennee        

    "In the middle of winter I at last discovered that there was in me an invincible summer."  A.Camus

    "Be the change you want!" Forum-wisdom

     

             

    Dipuc4Life
  • BlueWolfBlueWolf The grasslandsSilver Member Posts: 606
    edited September 2
    Should add that your marriage seems to be in a bad place but people have recovered from worse. And as they say here,  the stay plan is the same as the go plan. You better yourself til you are in a position to demand change in the marriage. Or leave if that doesn't work.

    "The male lion doesn't get pissy." Tennee        

    "In the middle of winter I at last discovered that there was in me an invincible summer."  A.Camus

    "Be the change you want!" Forum-wisdom

     

             

  • DaddyOhDaddyOh CTGold Men Posts: 1,589
    Explain the lack of kids?
    Also, what kind of financial hit would you take if you decided on D?
    "How vain it is to sit down and write when you have not stood up to live."
  • markymapomarkymapo Silver Member Posts: 542
    Welcome...

    Your need to rule out an affair. 
    Yes, some women act that way being in affairs but it could be the past 7 years have been so stressful that she's put up defenses and is checking out. 

    Its great she's getting therapy for past SA. 


    And I wouldn't start talking about having kids anytime soon. That will not fix anything. You two are not in a position to deal with little babies. It will add to the stress. 

    So this has been going on for a really long time. Plus no sex within the last 2 years. I'm surprised you stayed. I'll give kuddos to that. 

    Youll need to go through the phases mentioned in the book (did you read it?)
  • PaladinPaladin USASilver Member Posts: 88
    Sounds like you have checked out too? In my previous marriage,  my wife and I were apart every week for 2.5 years. We married young, and she was away at school 4-5 days a week. She was having an affair with her boss, whom she later married. Looking back, us being apart, I created a whole new life for myself, and she did as well. We both sucked at it, and although i never swayed from my marriage, I felt the same as you at times as it didnt matter. As stated above, you can fix this, but work on fixing yourself first. I am MAPing and its doing incredible small things for myslef to remember what i want to be, and repair things that i messed up of myself.  Just remember too,  The SA therapy can bring up a lot of emotions that have been dormant for so long. 
  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    Thanks for all the feedback. There are a lot of questions so I'll answer them here:

    I have been investing in myself for at least the past year. Last year I decided to put aside money every month regardless of what she was moaning about to re-invest in making myself a better man and this year I have done quite a bit to build me (reading, exercise etc). Also started hitting the Gym in January and have been seeing great results.

    Early in the relationship she was the one to bring up kids. Talking about how she had a dream where she was going somewhere for a short trip and I was taking her to the airport and that she was pregnant in the dream. After all the legal drama started she straight up said that she wasn't going to have any until the situation got resolved. Not looking to have any myself ... I've realized that I'm pretty selfish and that kids are a huge time and financial investment. Not that it's on the table in either case.

    I am not planning on having an affair. Regardless of whether she is having one or not. I just mentioned it because it would be very easy for me as women are literally throwing themselves at me sometimes. I work on a private island (about half hour by boat only) so access is controlled. While I'm there I live in staff housing which is pretty shit. Not conducive to building any kind of mood or having any kind of activity as there is very little to do there. And although her business depends on her skills (private chef) there would be very little work for her unless she worked in one of the restaurants. She has mentioned that she wouldn't work in a restaurant, ever.

    I know that my time spent away from home is the biggest hurdle. Her main complaint was that I am not there when the rubber hits the road. I am looking at finding another job but there aren't that many that pay well enough to not cause strain on the finances.

    And no, I don't feel like I've checked out. I still find her more sexy than any of the women who want to ride my pony. I'm also not planning on staying at this job forever. I think I can make the best of a bad situation. But she still treats me indifferently or at least acts like I'm indifferent and tries to ignore me like I don't matter to her. She has softened in recent weeks especially after a recent event described below:

    I was at work sitting in my Bosses office assisting her on a computer issue. My phone rings and it's her, so I figure it's something important for her to call during the day. Immediately she comes on the phone asking questions about something that happened recently that I had no idea about. I was calm and answered her directly and to the point. I guess that pissed her off. She then starts going on about not relaying some information to my family about something that happened recently and how SHE felt bad that I didn't say anything. I calmly told her that I was at work and we can talk about this later. Of course she starts raising her voice to the point where I know my boss could hear.

    I had enough. I hung up on her ass. Never did that before LOL. Two hours later when I went to lunch I called her back. She immediately comes on the phone with attitude. But I tell her never to do that shit again. That if I'm at work and something is important call me and ask me to call her back rather than giving me attitude. I also set the record straight on the whole issue and did not apologize. She became amenable right away and calmed down saying she was wrong and wouldn't do that again. I think I passed the shit test.


  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    I never said that she had to re-invest. She is working to grow the business and she as such she ends up spending the profits to make the business better. Taking out ads and offering new services that require new equipment doesn't come for free. I would do the same thing to make my business grow if I had one.

    In any case I stopped supporting the business on top of paying the bills. I used to do that before with other failed business ventures and I realized that I was resentful at her for constantly putting me in a tough position financially. I'm done with that. I'm working on getting her to pull her weight. It's as you say a reasonable expectation.

    Oh and just as an aside my company requires all employees to work 6 days a week. When you are in the hospitality business in my country it's expected.
  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    edited September 3
    I got a question that just occurred to me this morning. What does it mean if I am noticeably improving myself and the more I improve the more she withdraws? I started noticing this around the time I decided that I was done being out of shape and being a pushover. Isn't it generally supposed to work in the opposite direction to where my improvements cause her to be more attracted. Instead I sometimes feel she is trying her best not to fall for me (again) by making herself unavailable and busy with everything else. Any time I approach her to talk she is talking (sometimes loudly) on the phone to one of her friends. As soon as the call ends she calls up another friend or otherwise makes herself unavailable before I can get in a word. Also over the last month or so she seems to always invites her female friends over when I am coming home. They feel like a buffer. She avoids having a conversation or communicating with me face to face unless she has to and can be curt with answers to questions I've asked her. I know I need to get her to open up, even if just a tiny bit, but I'm at a loss at how. Maybe I just need to back off. But it seems that backing off especially over the last few months is making things worse. Before that I was sometimes not available in the relationship and she has mentioned this to me before. I would love to get things out in the open to where we can have an honest dialogue but it seems I have a ways to go before she can trust me. Am I screwed here?
  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    fredless said:
    From what you describe, she doesn't appear attracted to you.  You map for you...your go plan and your stay plan are the same...so continue to make yourself awesome.  I also think you might want to investigate further into the possibility of an affair on her part.
    That may or may not be the case on her attraction. I just want clarity on the whole thing. And I plan on continuing to work on me. I realized that at some points in our marriage I was a complete failure as a man and a husband and I'm willing to take responsibility for that whatever the outcome.

    I also don't think that she is having an affair but anything is possible. Also at this point it doesn't matter if she was/is having an affair. So investigating and spending my time and energy on whether or not is kinda pointless. I can only affect the outcome of one persons actions. My own. I've gotta live in my own skin and with my own frame.

    If I choose to stay it will not be a factor in my decision and if I choose to leave it will not be because of that either.
  • fredlessfredless Silver Member Posts: 2,842
    What does it mean if I am noticeably improving myself and the more I improve the more she withdraws? It means that she is not attracted.

    Any time I approach her to talk she is talking (sometimes loudly) on the phone to one of her friends. As soon as the call ends she calls up another friend or otherwise makes herself unavailable before I can get in a word. Evidence she is not attracted to you.

    Also over the last month or so she seems to always invites her female friends over when I am coming home. They feel like a buffer. She avoids having a conversation or communicating with me face to face unless she has to and can be curt with answers to questions I've asked her. Evidence she is not attracted to you.

    I know I need to get her to open up, even if just a tiny bit, but I'm at a loss at how. Open up how?  Emotionally?  Sexually?  This is not going to happen unless she's attracted to you.

    I would love to get things out in the open to where we can have an honest dialogue but it seems I have a ways to go before she can trust me. If she's having an affair, and there are some red flags that she might be, you can forget about having any kind of "honest dialogue" until such time that you have compiled incontrovertible evidence of the affair.
    I don't mean to be harsh, but I think it's important to be blunt.  Others may disagree with me but you asked for input and this is mine.
    Dipuc4LifeTenneeBlackwulf
  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    I am well aware that she is not attracted to me at the moment. I was just wondering if pulling away was some mechanism for her to protect herself. Thank for the input in either case.
  • fredlessfredless Silver Member Posts: 2,842
    I am well aware that she is not attracted to me at the moment. I was just wondering if pulling away was some mechanism for her to protect herself. Thank for the input in either case.
    There are several reasons a woman might pull away.  She might pull away if she perceives that you are too awesome and that you are going to leave her because she can't keep up with you and there is nothing she can do to stop you from leaving. 

    She might pull away because she is not attracted to you.  Of course, she may pull away if she is having an affair but that would also be tied into her not being attracted to you.


    Dipuc4LifeTenneeZot
  • AngelineAngeline planting seedsCategory Moderator** Posts: 14,500
    I'd just like to point out here that withdrawing because she thinks she can't catch up does not mean she is not attracted. You are in the best position to know which is true of your wife, if you can be brutally honest with yourself.

    Whether or not she is attracted, you still have things to work on, right? You need to do those things anyway, or you'll end up in another relationship just as weak as this one. People attract mates at their level of dysfunction or health. 
    "Speak your truth." - Scarlet
    Remember to play!
    Do the right thing, whether anyone is watching or not.
    Be married, until you are not.

    Email address: angeline.greenwood@att.net
    Dipuc4LifeTennee
  • LadyOrTheTygerLadyOrTheTyger EarthSilver Member Posts: 892
    Given what the OP has posted I think it's highly unlikely that his wife sees him as soon amazingly awesome that it's hopeless to try to keep up.  It's more likely she sees him as a part-time housemate who sometimes gets annoyingly intrusive into her own life. 

    This is going to take time. It has taken years to establish yourselves as part time housemates. You're not going to change her view of you in a few weeks. And when you try to air grievances about sex and get things out in the open, her subconscious sees it as her roommate getting creepy. So she invites friends over as a buffer.  It's galling to contemplate but you really have established yourself as a platonic roommate and her reflex action is going to be the same as any woman whose platonic roommate started wanting to get sexual. Except her higher human brain knows you're her husband and dampens the reaction. She creates distance and avoids you rather than calling the landlord and having you evicted.  
    Dipuc4LifeTenneeHowlAtTheMoon
  • Dipuc4LifeDipuc4Life Member Posts: 10
    edited September 4
    @LadyOrTheTyger ... I get what you are saying. I'm not even deluding myself to think that we can talk about sex or intimacy at the moment. In the beginning of the relationship she chased me quite a bit. I was attracted to her but was trying to stay faithful to my Girlfriend of a few years at the time. There was definitely something there that she saw that she liked. Now to remember the ingredients that were in the secret sauce LOL.

    As I am typing this I had a thought. Maybe she thinks I am being unfaithful. I'm not but I know she sees that I am improving myself and may think that another woman might be the reason. That couldn't be further from the truth but there is the fact that I was cheating with her and she was well aware of it at the time. Her actions just tie directly with my getting more fit and building my confidence back so I was curious if it was weird to think that.

    Edit: I just wanted to state that she is still sexy, beautiful and and in shape. So I'm not sure if she thinks that I am so far out of her reach. I also know that she does have a huge persecution complex. It was definitely the time she spent fighting in court and the time in Prison that amplified this belief. She has never had a good relationship with her mother who brushed the childhood abuse under the rug and has said on many occasions that she was just tolerated by her mother while her younger brother got all the love and attention. Yes, she is equally messed up.
  • LadyOrTheTygerLadyOrTheTyger EarthSilver Member Posts: 892
    As long as you're being transparent and not acting sneaky, there's really nothing you can do if she thinks you're cheating. Protesting your innocence will have the opposite effect.  
    Tennee
  • AngelineAngeline planting seedsCategory Moderator** Posts: 14,500

    As I am typing this I had a thought. Maybe she thinks I am being unfaithful. I'm not but I know she sees that I am improving myself and may think that another woman might be the reason. That couldn't be further from the truth but there is the fact that I was cheating with her and she was well aware of it at the time. Her actions just tie directly with my getting more fit and building my confidence back so I was curious if it was weird to think that.
    That is pretty common actually, and I disagree that there's nothing you can do. Being on this site might make you kind of secretive about your phone, so learn how to use anonymous browsing and be really diligent about logging out, and you can afford to be careless about leaving your phone lying around or your computer on. Be casual and open about your comms.

    Be cheerful and determined and behave as if things are the way you'd like them to be.

    If she's secretive or hostile or negative, that's a different problem you handle as you go along, but for now you're dressing better and working out etc. just because you want to live a vibrant, active, awake, passionate life. If you believe it, you'll sell it.

    You may still get the questions, but don't feel defensive or guilty about wanting to improve your life, and your answers will reflect that.
    "Speak your truth." - Scarlet
    Remember to play!
    Do the right thing, whether anyone is watching or not.
    Be married, until you are not.

    Email address: angeline.greenwood@att.net
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