Submit to your husbands

Mr_Brown

Here are a couple of passages I ran across and felt like sharing:

1 Peter 3:1-5

New International Version (NIV)

3 Wives, in the same way submit yourselves to your own husbands so that, if any of them do not believe the word, they may be won over without words by the behavior of their wives, ² when they see the purity and reverence of your lives. ³ Your beauty should not come from outward adornment, such as elaborate hairstyles and the wearing of gold jewelry or fine clothes. ⁴ Rather, it should be that of your inner self, the unfading beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is of great worth in God’s sight. ⁵ For this is the way the holy women of the past who put their hope in God used to adorn themselves. They submitted themselves to their own husbands,

Ephesians 5:22-24

New International Version (NIV)

²² Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. ²³ For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. ²⁴ Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

Colossians 3:18

New International Version (NIV)

Instructions for Christian Households

¹⁸ Wives, submit yourselves to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord.

1 Timothy 2:11

New International Version (NIV)

¹¹ A woman^[a] should learn in quietness and full submission

Titus 2:3-5

New International Version (NIV)

³ Likewise, teach the older women to be reverent in the way they live, not to be slanderers or addicted to much wine, but to teach what is good. ⁴ Then they can urge the younger women to love their husbands and children, ⁵ to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, to be kind, and to be subject to their husbands, so that no one will malign the word of God.

Athol_Kay

Danger Will Robinson! Danger!

http://marriedmansexlife.com/2010/08/evoking-submissive-desires-vs-justifying-demanding-them/

jklm

Not so long ago out of curiosity I finally looked up the context, i.e. what comes before "Wives, in the same way submit yourselves to your husbands," and hoo boy is it instructive. The preface is that slaves should submit to their masters, even and especially if everyone knows those masters are mean jerks, in an attempt to teach them how to be worthwhile (plus everyone will see what a good person you are for respecting them even when they don't deserve it). Wives, in the same way...

Notelrac

1 Peter 2:18-20

¹⁸ Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh. ¹⁹ For it is commendable if someone bears up under the pain of unjust suffering because they are conscious of God. ²⁰ But how is it to your credit if you receive a beating for doing wrong and endure it? But if you suffer for doing good and you endure it, this is commendable before God. ²¹ To this you were called, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should follow in his steps.

jklm

There's the one :-)

NeoTheLeo

I am not the religious type at all but I can say that I have witnessed many good Godly women turn their marriage and husbands around by being faithful and following those verses. It wasn't easy but over time, the men saw the faithfulness from their wife regardless and it made a huge impact.. 

 

Serenity

What are your thoughts on these verses?  Why are you sharing them?  Context, please.

Mr_Brown

To follow that up on what @Athol said I feel that in order for a woman to submit herself, a man needs to play several roles to provoke the submission:

The man needs to be a KING:
Have strong convictions
Make courageous moral choices
Have a servant’s heart
and lead righteously

He needs to be a WARRIOR:
Aggressive strength
“Stick-to-it-iveness”
Strength to overcome
and a “Never say die” attitude

He needs to be a FRIEND:
Loyal
Accountable
Challenging
and Fun

and a LOVER:
Have the ability to see wife’s needs
Have sensitivity toward others
Show tenderness
Emotional openness
and Display physical affection

Red

New International Version Ephesians 5:

5 ¹ Follow God’s example, therefore, as dearly loved children ² and walk in the way of love, just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us as a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.

²¹ Submit to one another out of reverence for Christ.

²² Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. ²³ For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. ²⁴ Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

²⁵ Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her ²⁶ to make her holy, cleansing^b]">[b] her by the washing with water through the word, ²⁷ and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. ²⁸ In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. ²⁹ After all, no one ever hated their own body, but they feed and care for their body, just as Christ does the church— ³⁰ for we are members of his body


Husbands are called to submit themselves to God and wives to submit themselves to a man submitted to God.  Husbands should love their wives as they love themselves.  Leaders serve those they lead. 

Mr_Brown

Serenity said:

What are your thoughts on these verses?  Why are you sharing them?  Context, please.

In my household there has been a power struggle and it seems to be based on the hardheadedness of my wife to admit that she is not the captain. She is an excellent contributor to the day to day operations of the house and that is the reason which I chose her to be my wife. Now that she has taken on the role of SAHM she has stepped up and wants to "Captain the ship". I used to have a better foothold on some of the operations and I am coming to the conclusion that I have given her too much power and I must retract it and take ownership again of these tasks (bills, schedules, gatherings) and I am getting pushback. This has caused dissension in the ranks. As I move closer to Phase 4 I have been relying on books notes blogs and scripture to frame myself in order to better myself as part of my MAP. I have recently ran across a lot of red pill information in the Bible and felt I should share and see what others points of view are toward the thoughts/verses and What better place to do it than here?

Serenity

I have a submissive nature to my husband, and I am a committed Christian, but I could never submit because he quoted those verses to me.  In fact, it would be an immediate DLV.  Submission is earned.

Tread carefully with those verses.  In fact, I mostly find that it's better to take out of the Bible what I myself need, instead of looking for lessons for other people.

Mr_Brown

Serenity said:

I have a submissive nature to my husband, and I am a committed Christian, but I could never submit because he quoted those verses to me.  In fact, it would be an immediate DLV.  Submission is earned.

Tread carefully with those verses.  In fact, I mostly find that it's better to take out of the Bible what I myself need, instead of looking for lessons for other people.

I agree if you are not a MAN you will not be treated as such... Hence the list above. That is my list in no particular order:
King=Leading
Warrior=Working out
Friend=Loyalty/Doing the right thing
Lover=Good Beta
Physical affection=result of the MAP

PhoenixDown

If you're using the verses for your own personal reflection, good stuff. Just never use it in conversation as a way to logic your way into dominance, 'cause it won't work, unfortunately. 

x1134x

I was taught that the key here (obviously) is the word: SUBMIT. Its the whole "hebrew doesn't translate to english very well sometimes"

sub·mit  

verb (used with object)

1. to give over or yield to the power or authority of another (often used reflexively).

2. to subject to some kind of treatment or influence.

3. to present for the approval, consideration, or decision of another or others: to submit a plan; to submit an application.

4. to state or urge with deference; suggest or propose (usually followed by a clause): I submit that full proof should be required.

It doesn't mean "let your husband domineer over you, make all your decisions, and just suck it up and live with it".   It means "take your issues, discussions, and questions to your husband, just like you would to the lord"  In the same way you'd "submit" a paper to your professor for review. It ties into the idea that in the old testament the man in the family is the religious teacher:

"...women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."

 - 1 Corinthians 14:34-35

Serenity

Sorry, we cross-posted.  So, why do you think you're getting push-back now?  What has happened to change things?  Does she acknowledge that she wants more control?

Mr_Brown said:

Serenity said:

What are your thoughts on these verses?  Why are you sharing them?  Context, please.

In my household there has been a power struggle and it seems to be based on the hardheadedness of my wife to admit that she is not the captain. She is an excellent contributor to the day to day operations of the house and that is the reason which I chose her to be my wife. Now that she has taken on the role of SAHM she has stepped up and wants to "Captain the ship". I used to have a better foothold on some of the operations and I am coming to the conclusion that I have given her too much power and I must retract it and take ownership again of these tasks (bills, schedules, gatherings) and I am getting pushback. This has caused dissension in the ranks. As I move closer to Phase 4 I have been relying on books notes blogs and scripture to frame myself in order to better myself as part of my MAP. I have recently ran across a lot of red pill information in the Bible and felt I should share and see what others points of view are toward the thoughts/verses and What better place to do it than here?

Mr_Brown

Serenity said:

Sorry, we cross-posted.  So, why do you think you're getting push-back now?  What has happened to change things?  Does she acknowledge that she wants more control?

Mr_Brown said:

Serenity said:

What are your thoughts on these verses?  Why are you sharing them?  Context, please.

In my household there has been a power struggle and it seems to be based on the hardheadedness of my wife to admit that she is not the captain. She is an excellent contributor to the day to day operations of the house and that is the reason which I chose her to be my wife. Now that she has taken on the role of SAHM she has stepped up and wants to "Captain the ship". I used to have a better foothold on some of the operations and I am coming to the conclusion that I have given her too much power and I must retract it and take ownership again of these tasks (bills, schedules, gatherings) and I am getting pushback. This has caused dissension in the ranks. As I move closer to Phase 4 I have been relying on books notes blogs and scripture to frame myself in order to better myself as part of my MAP. I have recently ran across a lot of red pill information in the Bible and felt I should share and see what others points of view are toward the thoughts/verses and What better place to do it than here?

I think with her not working, she is feeling like she isn't contributing (which she definitely is a great SAHM thanks to some @Athol_Kay SAHM+ rules) and by having control of more she is making things easier on me (which it is to an extent), but i am getting push-back on a lot of little issues which she used to defer to me. My track record should speak for itself. We were holding a couple of forts down and had some pretty turbulent situations which we have come out unscathed together, just a lot of bumps in the road. Now, to me the things we have to deal with now is trivial. The heavy lifting has been done and now lets reap the rewards so to speak. Our worries now are no where near what they were 2-5 years ago. Which I lead us through. She has stated I don't know how you did it! (Umm you deferred to my logic!!)

The day to day of handling things like schedules, thank you cards, party planning and appointments are hers. The bills, basically what i am working on, is that she organizes everything for me and I "sign the checks" determine how much goes to savings and I approve what comes out of savings if needed. She is fairly frugal (if i use this card i get 5%, coupons, yada yada) and I make sure she doesn't get out of control. Lately I've gotten well we needed this or that but to me it wasn't necessary.

I got us through some difficult situations because I didn't do anything unnecessary. I am probably more cautious now because of the single paycheck coming in and felt forced to tighten the leash.

Is it the tightening of the leash the SAHM part
This probably wouldn't bother me as much if her vagina wasn't still closed for business.

Serenity

Yeah, it is tricky business with a newborn in the house. 

And I found it more difficult not to spend money after I became a SAHM because you've got all day to see all these things that need doing or need to be bought. When I was working a FT job, I didn't have time to notice that things around the house were falling apart, the dishcloths had holes, the rugs were getting tattered, etc.

Kathrynthegreat

RedPillWifey said:

If you're using the verses for your own personal reflection, good stuff. Just never use it in conversation as a way to logic your way into dominance, 'cause it won't work, unfortunately. 

Yeah, that whole eye, plank thing.  Once you're perfect you can quote scripture at me.  

KatherineKelly

If the man is all that you described it would not be submission but love so is not a debt but a gift.

The womans relationship to God is to care for the body of God which is life as the physical manifestation of God.

The mans relationship to God is to know the mind of God which is the consciousness of God inside life that woman care for which calls to him.

The man brings what he learns by following and experiencing this calling to the woman who than understands her purpose in relation to God and through the man learns to understand the mind of God.

When the man witnesses the woman caring for life his mind is opened so that he may become sensitive to the calling of the consciousness of God inside him.

The woman caring for the man opens his mind to God so God than flows through and out of the man and is presented to the woman who is able to learn about the mind of God inside the body of God (life) she cares for.

A mans mind is uniquely designed to receive the consciousness of God but the needs of life must be met for this to become possible.

Men and women stand at opposite ends to God and through each other understand the totality of God as body and mind.

Without harmonious relations between men and women the consciousness of God cannot be experienced and expressed so God stops supporting the life that no longer serves his consciousness expressed through life.

KatherineKelly

For you Mr_Brown

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAvfdwypmnw&feature=relmfu

 

Jacquie

I just read this on another site within the past couple of days so I cannot take any credit for it. I would like to give credit where credit is due, but for the nature of the site and privacy issues I cannot; just wanted to make note that it is not mine, although I share it because I thought it fit in with this thread and I loved the way in which it was written.

•Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. Eph. 5:22
•Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing. Eph. 5:24
•Nevertheless let everyone of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband. Eph. 5:33<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Also, "Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands;" I Peter 3:1a

None of these passages teach that women are inferior in intellect, but rather that her feminine qualities preclude her being as well equipped for family leadership. The subjection does not mean servitude. It is not the relationship of master and slave or as a maid or servant. Rather, her roles is a recognition of the husband's leadership, wisdom and tenderness. His love toward her should be as Christ's love for the church - sacrificial.

At this point, there are several privileges that belong to the wife. For instance, she is to be loved like Christ loved the church as commanded in Ephesians 5:25. She is to be honored as none other in I Peter 3:7, and she is to be praised by her family, Pro. 31:28.

In Titus 2:4 we read, "That (the aged women) may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, to be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed". Here is a fine list of the responsibilities of the wife. All of these are important, but let us just dwell on four of these.

"To love their husbands" is a command. Too often, this is understood by men to be only a sexual relationship; unfortunately, in the mind of some women, that is all they think they are good for. To love your husband means that you are a partner with him, working together toward a common goal. Then you can be appreciative of his actions, efforts and work in supporting the family. You will do all that you possibly can to see that he is comfortable and happy when he comes home.

"To love their children" is another command. As men provide for the family financially, mothers stay home and rear the children. This might often be considered a thankless job. This is an area in which you can excel. As he earns the living and supports the family, you take care of the children while he is gone to work and make the house comfortable by keeping it pleasant and enjoyable. Yes, children can become exasperating at times, but remember, they are children who are still developing and learning. They need that sober, guiding hand of the mature mother, who lets them know that they are the objects of her love and concern.

"To be obedient to their own husband" is a command, yet it points out the closeness of the two. This is not indicating that you cannot and do not have any thoughts of your own. The idea is that husband and wife work together and that you are not constantly pulling in an opposite direction. The harshness of the word obedient is tempered by the display of love and affection that the husband is to show his wife.

"To be keepers at home" is a command that indicates a divided responsibility. His job seems to be to go out and earn the living and provide for his family, while she looks after the home. Even though a wife does not work outside of the home in what we call public work, she is still vital to the income of the family. Hers is a non-income producing activity, but good management of the home is still vitally important to the overall success of the family.

When God created woman, she was taken from the rib of man as is described in Genesis 2. She was not taken from his foot that she might be crushed underneath his heel in bitterness. Neither was she taken from his head so that she might rule over him. She was not taken from the hand so that she might continually fill the position of waiting upon him. She was taken from the rib of man that she might be by his side continually, and always close to his heart. She is to be loved and is to respond as a part of his body. Husbands and wives are a part of each other; two become one.

Let me call your attention to the Old Testament in which the writer Solomon describes a worthy woman. Read Proverbs 31:10-31. These verses quite clearly give us God's view of a wife and mother. It has only been in the past century, and largely due to the advertising campaigns of large diamond mining companies, that diamonds have been considered to be of great worth. Rubies have traditionally been considered much, much more precious than diamonds. This is the stone used in the description of the virtuous woman's worth. The virtuous woman and Godly wife is a great treasure in the eyes of a wise, God-fearing man.