I've been all over the internet lately reading Christian men and women rail against 50 Shades of Grey. The men often lament it is porn and porn is bad. The women often lament that women even like a book where a woman is treated in such an undignified manner. I read one supposedly conservative Christian lament the power imbalance the book portrays. Apparently a woman should only enjoy sex when there is no power imbalance.
Now..for the sake of clarity I want to say that I am not much into BDSM. A little aggression in the bedroom is fine but you can skip the whips and chains, thankyouverymuch. I also have more than my share of ego and find words such as "slut" and "little bitch" and other such terms of endearment, not very endearing at all.
That said, I know that power is attractive. Whether it is athleticism, intellectualism, or just masculine charisma... I like feeling like someone with options has "chosen" me. According to Evo-psyche this "hypergamy" is how I qualify worthy sperm.
So what does that have to do with religion?
I am interested in how all this evo-psyche symbolizes ontological truths about "masculine" and "feminine" energies. How creation relates to God and visa-versa.
Now an atheist would say "Oh, you mean the myths humans use to explain natural realities." and for the purpose of this discussion it probably doesn't matter if you think nature is the reality and religion is the symbolism or you think the religion is reality and nature is the symbolism..so long as you actually see the symbolism. Atheists who see all religion as just a bunch of silly non-sense that stupid people believe won't have much to offer.
When you think about man and woman as symbols..Man symbolizes God and Woman symbolizes creation..then the roles of man as Giver and woman as Receiver is imbued with more meaning.
In human kinds relationship with God we have a few responsibilities 1. ask for what we need 2. be receptive to Grace 3. be aware of our weaknesses 4. give due reverence. In turn God provides for our needs and protects us from evil (to the extent that is compatible with His Will).
There are so many erotic illusions in the Bible and in contemporary Christian music. You Consume Me by DC Talk is the most obvious example. The song is asking God to possess..take hold of... dominate. It isn't so different from the sexual cravings of a heterosexual woman. (And yes, that song does kinda turn me on..lol)
With that preface..the real thing I want to discuss is how to differentiate between "lust" and legitimate "desire". Also..how to dispel the myth that dominate behavior is sinful. I've seen this attitude too many times to count..that the only holy sex is the kind where the man is supplicating and gentle.
God is sometimes gentle and sometimes not. I think it depends on what He senses we can handle. And a man is usually going to go gentle on virgin and probably a little less gentle on his wife of 20 years. God was not gentle when he made Paul fall off his horse. He wasn't gentle when He had a whale swallow Jonah. He displayed serious dominance towards Moses, while simultaneously affirming him of his purpose.
But how do you differentiate between lust and desire? I think it is in the intent. Do you want to get yours with little regard for the other person? Or are you mindful of the others persons emotional and psychological needs?
I think what we often see in society is relating power and dominance to rape and because rape is bad power and dominance must be also. But what makes rape wrong isn't the dominance, its the taking what doesn't belong to you. Many (not all) women have rape fantasies and I think this points to the fact that they crave power and dominance. If we lived in a more patriarchal society perhaps women wouldn't go to such extremes in their fantasy lives.
To me..the biggest difference between love and lust is that love takes responsibility while lust just takes.
Comments
morticia
I'd heard that sort of thing when I was still a Christian. It kinda sounds like a blend of Christianity and Wicca. Wiccans are seriously into the sexual diety(ies) stuff. We need to get Ian Ironwood in here commenting. I think he's into some kind of modern paganism, at least it sounded like it on his blog.
Honestly, I think a lot of contemporary Christian music is popular culture repackaged in Christian terms. That's why it often comes off sounding so sexual. "Kiss Me" by Sixpence None the Richer is a good example of that. I love that song! It's not really that Christian when you listen to what it's actually saying though.
Seeing human sexual relationships as a metaphor for the divine is a very Wiccan idea, from what I've read about the religion. Hence the sky-clad (nude!) practitioners. Not all of them celebrate their liturgy in the nude, but some still do. I haven't studied the Wiccan religion extensively though so I can't point to any particular theology book or liturgical manual. I'm basing it on what I've read from Wiccans online, plus what a (sort of) Wiccan friend of mine has told me.
Seeing human sexual relationships as a metaphor for the divine also would have been verboten in many Christian churches only a few decades ago. I think popular culture is driving the change . Part of that is probably the fact that some Wiccan ideas are going mainstream, without being labeled Wiccan or pagan. One way that's happening is through some paranormal romance novels. The magic often has a Wiccan flavor.
The biggest driving force behind the change is probably just that our culture is so extremely sexual. Everything is about sex, including religion. Of course, Christianity always has been about sex to some extent, but it used to be in a more negative way. I was taught that sexual desire is a sin, oral sex is a sin, anal sex is a sin, sex toys are a sin, and on and on it went. That was only 15 - 20 years ago, when I was a teenager. I'm glad Christianity has loosened up about sex a little so people can enjoy themselves without guilt and fear of hell. It's kinda strange though seeing god and creation and humanity referred to in sexual terms.
the "thought police" that is encouraged by the abrahamic religions was probably put there to control the masses.
- KELINDA Star Trek TOS, "By any other name"
The ancient mystics did use the language of romantic devotion, but it usually seemed to be more from the emotional aspect, not sexual. I was Eastern Orthodox for a few years and read quite a bit from the ancient saints. Now, I didn't read much from the catholic writers after the Great Schism, so possibly Catholicism had more sexual stuff in that vein. Most orthodox I knew (all very conservative) would have been horrified at the very idea. Most conservative protestants would have been as well, until the last couple decades.
If you think Christisanity hasn't borrowed any ideas from Wicca, but Wicca has from Christianity, would you also say that Christianity hasn't been influenced by feminism, but feminism has been influenced by Christianity? Ideas flow back and forth between groups of people, even people who generally hate each other's guts. That's just how human societies work. Christianity isn't an exception to that.
I'm more of the opinion that the influence goes both ways, unless you can completely isolate your religious community, which is pretty unlikely.
You've mentioned in another thread that you are drinking Southern Comfort tonight. Are you discussing theology while (gasp!) half-lit? That's in line with Martin Luther, who supposedly did his best theologizing while drinking. But if you're Catholic, you aren't supposed to be emulating him...
I really am laughing out loud right now. LOL isn't just a figure of speech at this point. Did you like my devil smiley face?
I haven't been drinking anything but vanilla flavored almond milk tonight. Can't have alcoholic beverages. I'm allergic.
Gotta go to bed though because both sick children are sound asleep now. Yay!
Lust suggests some form of covetness. - for something that isn't yours (or offered?)
Desire seems to be strong attraction - which in a righteous sense means something to be delighted in / enjoyed.
Re Domination and power v gentle submission (a paraphrase I know, but having read your initial post once and the comments, I don't want to scroll to the top again - reading fatigue today) I think the following: