How to smother a Starfish

Want2bFO

Ok, hypothetical situation. Lets say I initiate everytime I want sex, I have been in sexting, girl game , etc and he knows where I am sexually. I initiate and  I am OI. He refuses or is unavailable multiple nights in a row. Then eventually gives in. yeah SEX!  But its bad sex. Its the kind that feels like he is just going through the motions. He is following a dull roadmap at best and can't wait for it to be over. Its just touch her here, lick her there, blah blah blah  Frankly,  this is better than nothing but there are times that I's rather stay horny than feel this..

 What are your thoughts on tapping him out. Just saying something like "another time" and then moving on. Not being mean or pissy or pouty or angry . Just initiating, start f*cking, and at whatever moment I realize this is "starfish" and is it not going to get any better, I stop, or tap him out,  give a peck on the cheek and move on. Leave him as is, just hanging and confused.

I sincerely would love to know what the below posters say and of course any other forum-ers.

Is this move way too passive aggressive or simply not accepting sh*t.

 

@DaveBowman @Cubicle27 @SignorePillolaRosa @Eightbit  @LiveNlearn  @RedPillWifey.

 

JesusMarimba

On talk about marriage, that is usually viewed as emotional abuse if a man does it to a woman.

Personally, if your partner is 'meh' and then you become 'meh', I see no problem stopping.

hoping4better

What works for men (on women) and women (on men) is different.  Frankly it is unimaginable for most men here to even contemplate giving starfish sex....   yeah maybe one time you were drunk, or worked 22 hours... but as a regular deal.  Cannot process.  

sounds like Low T and/or low attraction.

Want2bFO

hoping4better said:

What works for men (on women) and women (on men) is different.  Frankly it is unimaginable for most men here to even contemplate giving starfish sex....   yeah maybe one time you were drunk, or worked 22 hours... but as a regular deal.  Cannot process.  

sounds like Low T and/or low attraction.

@hoping4etter ; Perhaps I live in a parallel universe from yours or perhaps it does happen to women. Just read the FO club section.

 In my case it is Low- T that is currently being medically addressed however still don't know what to do about the above.
Your unimaginable comment was kinda cute....made me smile.

)

Britguy68

Yep I can't imagine this as a guy. He has to be low t to be completely uninterested. I'd say that you can see he's not into it and that's it just a complete turn off for you. Bet trueful but don't get pissy. I think that's the advice I would get if the situation was reversed. At least it gives him something to think about.

JesusMarimba

Britguy68 said:

Yep I can't imagine this as a guy. He has to be low t to be completely uninterested. I'd say that you can see he's not into it and that's it just a complete turn off for you. Bet trueful but don't get pissy. I think that's the advice I would get if the situation was reversed. At least it gives him something to think about.

A few weeks ago I think my T dropped through the floor. I mean, like it was a night and day shift. Everything went 'blah' overnight. I stopped the drive-bys. I stopped initiating. I could care less about sex.

After about three days I put two and two together. I started popping about 20k iu of vitamin D, chomped a ton of broccoli and cauliflower and made sure to keep up with my workouts. It took about a week and a half for me to feel (mostly) normal again.

But in that time I had duty-sex. No, my wife didn't initiate, but she came to bed and gave just about every indicator that she wanted me to. 

So I rolled over and said to myself, "Hah hah, suck it. I don't want to. I'm going to sleep."

And then I daydreamed about fighting Darth Vader with my kids who were jedi and we piloted starfighters and... well it's kind of a running daydream. It's a thing.

But AFTER that I thought, "Dude. You're being a dick. Do the right thing."

So I rolled over and within seconds she was cracking her toes and stretching. I'd called it.

So I made sure she got her cookie and then she said, "Your turn." My response was, "I'm good. I'm very tired. Going to sleep now."

Now imagine being like that for years. Where doing the duty fuck has become a chore and you don't want to do ANY chores...

That's low T.

Want2bFO

Britguy68 said:

Yep I can't imagine this as a guy. He has to be low t to be completely uninterested. I'd say that you can see he's not into it and that's it just a complete turn off for you. Bet trueful but don't get pissy. I think that's the advice I would get if the situation was reversed. At least it gives him something to think about.

His T is improving .We do not have a followup lab work yet to know if the dosing has to be adjusted. I really try hard not to get pissy or mean. My goal is never to hurt him for several reason including that I love him totally.  I know what pound-through-the-mattress sex is like . He has given me that aplenty and we will get that back.  I just felt uncertain about the starfish sex.

Want2bFO

 

JesusMarimba said

Now imagine being like that for years. Where doing the duty fuck has become a chore and you don't want to do ANY chores...

That's low T.

I hear your pain. But your a good man for doing all you can to fix it. I wont beret him. I am known for being inpatient. So, you mentioned supplements. Are you going natural or T therapy?

Serenity

The thing that finally turned our dynamics around was when I became sexually unavailable to my husband.  I had accepted low sex/crappy sex for years because that was all I could get. It was a total DLV and created a dynamic where he considered himself the prize and all he had to do was show up.  Even after the T got fixed, the dynamic didn't change all that much.

I finally had enough and stopped initiating with him, stopped showing him interest, stopped flirting, stopped everything.  When he finally had to start pursuing me was when it clicked with him and he got interested again. 

Our moms told us to play 'hard to get' and turns out there's some truth to that.  Men are created to hunt and pursue. When it's too easy for them, they lose interest.

Until he starts pursuing you and doing the things that trigger your responsive desire, I think you should ignore anything sexual with him. It may take a while as the T therapy does its work, but let him do the chasing.

liquid

I am in a similar situation - he has LowT but no treatment beyond Vit D as of yet.

About a month - 6 weeks? - ago we had a low point sexually and I decided to stop initiating altogether. I am available but that is it. We have had less sex but the sex itself has been way better. I'd like it 4-5x per week (where we were before his T dropped like 2 years ago) and he is at 1-2x but I am more satisfied this way. He is more into me so the quality is much better

So what would happen if you stopped initiating? Do you think all sex would stop?

And - I would not stop sex in the middle, as I know it would demoralize him.

hoping4better

Want2bFO said:

hoping4better said:

What works for men (on women) and women (on men) is different.  Frankly it is unimaginable for most men here to even contemplate giving starfish sex....   yeah maybe one time you were drunk, or worked 22 hours... but as a regular deal.  Cannot process.  

sounds like Low T and/or low attraction.

@hoping4etter ; Perhaps I live in a parallel universe from yours or perhaps it does happen to women. Just read the FO club section.

 In my case it is Low- T that is currently being medically addressed however still don't know what to do about the above.
Your unimaginable comment was kinda cute....made me smile.

)

It's actually an alternate universe, it is not just the same on the other side, or even the opposite.  I don't think the primer does anything really for women, except help them understand what causes attraction and response, but not as MAP etc.

If your husband is low T and grinding through sex with you to please you.  You should feel good.  The only thing that will get him to increase his efforts would be to tel him you need more sex and will have to look outside the marriage to get it if he does not pick up his efforts.  And then tell him you will work with him on it.  But unless he has that picture, he probably will be half invested at best.  Good luck.

JesusMarimba

Looking back, this has been happening about once a year for several years. Normally it takes months for me to get my mojo back.

This was the first time I recognized what was happening as it was happening.

I'm going natural for now. I still feel off, but I think the vitamin D has helped a lot. I read that broccoli and cauliflower help block estrogen, which blocks testosterone. So I've been eating that whenever possible. I don't know if it helps, but even if it's a placebo thing... it's still healthy food to eat.

I'm going in for a follow up to my physical in a few weeks. I'm going to ask for a T test to be done then. Hrm, maybe I'll schedule that appointment right now. Thanks!

LivNLearn

Serenity said:

When it's too easy for them, they lose interest.

I think you're really onto something here.  Even back in high school nobody wanted the super-easy chick (more than once at least).

DaveBowman

I wouldn't recommend bailing during sex.

Instead, if you're already doing the deed, I recommend going wild 'n crazy and at least trying to have fun for yourself.

If you're not already doing the deed, I recommend making him chase you. Lead, tempt, tease... make him work for it.

Want2bFO

CubicleZ7 said:

Wasn't he getting HRT?  What ever happened with that? 

Like practically everyone here has said at some point -- guys don't starfish women unless they are low-T (or using porn/fapping all the time).

Yes he is in HRT and yes it so much better. We do not have the follow up lab work so we don't know if the dose has to be adjusted. We wasted time on a non HRT MD that was happy giving him the minimum.  I can easily expect a good pounding once a week. I get lots of sexts and I am no longer invisible. But, there has been the starfish thing occasionally and I wanted to post this to see how to handle it. the T levels cant be normal yet and there is still work stress. I am my worse enemy. Patience is not my fortitude.

Want2bFO

Serenity said:

.

Until he starts pursuing you and doing the things that trigger your responsive desire, I think you should ignore anything sexual with him. It may take a while as the T therapy does its work, but let him do the chasing.

 

I didn't know this. I thought I was suppose to initiate everytime I wanted sex and be OI. I thought that holding back was buying into his frame. I forget I am the FO and the rules are different.

I not going to initiate anymore. I will be available. I will be patient. I will not be easy.

 

The sexting between us has been very hot this past week. He has been away. Interesting to see what distance will do.

 

He says he has had a woody every morning. A lot dam good that does me when he is away.

Want2bFO

LivNLearn said:

Serenity said:

When it's too easy for them, they lose interest.

I think you're really onto something here.  Even back in high school nobody wanted the super-easy chick (more than once at least).

I was never easy and I was never a tease either. But I loved a good make-out session. I found fond memories of the glory days.

SignorePillolaRossa

I have no good advice about that exact approach, hon ... in my pre red pill aware days, I think I abruptly ended bad sex maybe once or twice over the years but definitely not from a good alpha / OI frame and certainly with no lasting positive change

I think you need advice from the other HD FOs on how they spur on their LD husbands

 

JesusMarimba

shibari said:

JesusMarimba said:

I'm going natural for now. I still feel off, but I think the vitamin D has helped a lot.

If you notice a difference after a single 20.000 IU dose, your vit.D3 levels are shitty. With low vit.D3, you cannot have good T levels. Recommended read for dosage:
http://marriedmansexlife.vanillaforums.com/discussion/comment/222556/#Comment_222556

That's the post that led me to take the Vit D.

Serenity

Just a caveat.  It's not going to work until the T therapy kicks in, and may actually backfire if his libido hasn't picked up, yet.

So, wait until the timing is right.

Serenity

Here's another one that has proven really effective.  Wait until it's been a few nights and you know he's wanting sex that night.  Most guys have those unspoken signals that make you know he's ready.

Make plans to go out with your girlfriend that night, but don't tell him until the middle of the day.  If he says something about having sex that night, act all regretful and say, "Oh hon, I already made plans with Heather. I'm so sorry, maybe tomorrow night."  Build up the anticipation in his mind, until he's dying for it.

But you have to use self-discipline. The problem with we HD women is that we want it so bad that we have a hard time denying ourselves.  Use your self-control and play the long game.