My wife found MMSL - long

ddadddad Silver Member Posts: 791
Ads for divorce services started popping up on our PC.  She questioned me about it which I ignored and later when I was busy working in the yard found MMSL and she read many of my threads and postings.  She was very upset.  This was 3 weeks ago and I have not posted to MMSL since.  She has been reading MMSL and the forum since then.

The things that I remember that upset her were that I considered myself SR higher than her, that I felt I was Phase 4 ready for an ultimatum, that I questioned my attraction and love to her.  Also she was pretty upset that I would share those intimate details with strangers and not talk to her about it. There are probably more but I am jumbled trying to remember it all.  Lots of yelling, talked about divorce and it freaked out our kids.  She questioned if I was really willing to work on things and if she really wanted to keep trying.

Clearly as lots of forum members told me while I had done some good work myself I had not made enough changes in how I interact with her or given it enough time for her to believe in the changes.  In the end we both agreed that she is not happy and I still have work to do but we are both still willing to work on us because of the good times that we have had and can have and because we are both committed to try to do the best for our kids.

I posted some very hurtful things.  I was angry and I wrote that in the context that we weren’t talking, listening or willing to believe the other person because of what happened in the past.  I felt she didn’t care and wouldn’t read my MMSL or MAP books on my bedside table and that I didn’t care if she read my forum posts when I clearly said some hurtful stuff in them.  She suggested that it was very passive-aggressive that that I let it come up this way.  I now regret this attitude of mine.  It came from the fact that in the past years I have searched so many resources to try to improve our marriage many of them turned out to be very ‘blue pill’ and just told me to help more with the kids, buy more flowers, do the dishes, etc…. it didn’t help with attraction.

My thoughts on being phase 4 ultimatum ready were that I was ready to say something to her and I was trying to work out what that was.  Not at all ready to leave but I was ready to bring something brought out in the open just should not have done it this way.   So often I have read to take action not to talk about it so I was trying to show her through my action that I had changed before bringing it up.

On the “my SR higher than hers” I felt like we were similar when we met physically, both hot.  We were both fit but she had her career/life more together than me so she was higher than me.  Now her weight has gone up with kids but she is down to about the weight when we met and is pretty awesome for our age and has recently gotten tons of compliments from lots of people we know.  I am currently more fit, my career has done well and just the Male/Female thing as we are in our early 40’s.  I am/was not trying to discount what she has done and is doing for herself and our kids.  

On questioning my attraction for her I think this is 2 things; one is when she is negative it is not attractive and second is where when I trigger her drive it is really attractive to me.  The fact that I have done such a poor job in leading us and bringing out her drive I began to resent and blame her.  I began to wonder if I was attracted to her because I was doing such a poor job of bringing out her interest.
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Comments

  • ddadddad Silver Member Posts: 791
    Complicating all this she was in the middle of a job interview and had an offer 2 weeks just after she found my MMSL posts.  When she confirmed that our babysitter was good to go with this she got back OK great then, no how about 3 days a week(we would have to scramble to make up those days) then she didn’t know about even the 3 days a week!  So in the end she declined.  She is very committed to the well being of our kids.

    Childcare has been a challenge for us all along.  We went through a nanny that only worked 2 weeks, daycares/dayhomes that were crappy, one daycare that was working and eventually shut down due to bad management. One nanny that lived in and did very little but care for the kids.  Good with the youngest but challenged by the older 2.  Through all of this (past 11 years) my wife was very stressed by the childcare and it affected her in a couple good jobs.  Finally since our 3rd she stayed home.  She never planned to or wanted to be a SAHM.  She had a great career from her 20’s until being at home for the last 6ish years.  

    She is resentful that I didn’t do much with finding/interviewing nannies.  Granting that I helped find, check etc the daycares/day homes but she did more of the work finding the nannies.  The nanny allowed me to go back to work and we did that together because I wanted her input on it with the ones since then she has done the majority of the finding/interviewing etc as she was at home at the time.

    A big part of the problem is that she has never really recovered from the hurtful compulsive porn use that I did around the time our first 2 kids were born.  I was in the cycle of she is recovering with the new baby, I am so nice I won’t pressure her for sex just use the porn….  At the time I justified it as a good thing but it got out of control.  When there was a 2nd ‘discovery’ after our 2nd child was 2 the secrecy and lying was very hurtful.  At that time we separated for 6 weeks at her requirement.  We worked it out and I got help and stopped soon after that but she never really believed it.  This fueled a cycle of her not trusting me, sex not really comfortable for either of us, me resenting….  I have seen that over and over this has destroyed her trust and how it wrecked her believing me when I said how beautiful she was.

    The recent discovery led to some deep painful discussions about all this which has lead to a lot of openness.  She understands the that I want more sex and after the first couple days of trying to figure out where we stood on all this we have had sex more often and it has ranged from her forcing herself to do it for me to very hot.  Being physically fit definitely helps with responsiveness.  But far more so does directness and confidence.  My wife definitely is more responsive to my advances if they are strong, confident and direct.   I still am very poor in my communication with her.  I know she doesn’t really want to be cooking and cleaning etc so I struggle to ask her to do those things.  Recently I caught myself indirectly asking her to make dinner so I could work in the yard.

    It has been an enlightening time for me.  We have been more open about what we want and are missing from each other.  Listening to her - literally hearing what she says and remembering details.  Show her she is beautiful.  Acknowledge her in front of others.  

    Clearly my wife has indicated that she feels threatened by this whole situation.  She has set herself back career-wise for our kids if we were to divorce she would have limited options.  I tried to reassure her that I am not trying to get out of my obligations to our kids.  

    So what does this all mean now?  We both have committed to try to make this work.  I have a lot of work to do and the Gym is the easy part.
    Serenity
  • DaveBowmanDaveBowman Member Posts: 5,823
    Is she OK with you being here now?

    Darkhanynia
  • Noble1Noble1 CanadaMember Posts: 70
    For myself, I'm very new here still to posting. Have been a "lurker" here for a good while though. There are many very supportive people on here that will be supportive to the both if you. If "you" are an ass you will certainly be called out for it. Not saying "you" directly...just to point out it's the internet and the people here are helpful and will be honest and straight-forward. Good luck to both of you on here. Commit to really working together and communication. That will be key - as I'm learning myself.

    The secret to happiness is being able to answer.....

     

    ...if I wanted to, I could.

  • Im_a_ManIm_a_Man CanadaSilver Member Posts: 878
    Welcome @dmom do you have plans to start your own MAP?
    PhoenixDown
  • PhoenixDownPhoenixDown TejasGold Women Posts: 10,632
    edited October 2013
    Hi @dmom. I found my husband's copy of the Primer when he left it sitting out (before the forum, though), so I know what you're going through. Hope you stick around. This place is great for marriages. :)

    DaveBowmanRlwjr
  • OneEyedDrunkOneEyedDrunk Out West Silver Member Posts: 1,808
    @dmom, this forum is where we work to improve ourselves which carries over into the marriage. It's a win-win for both parties. As for not telling you some stuff? It's not very effective to bitch about things. The forum is big on taking action to improve things. This was a good place for him to vent, and get help with strategies to improve.

    @ddad, keep coming here to learn, and work to be the best version of you possibly. Your wife will continue to take notice, and will appreciate what you are doing.

    oneeyeddrunk.weebly.com
    MiddleMan
  • dalefdalef Silver Member Posts: 1,963
    Of course, sometimes they don't even realize what their flaws are.
    [Deleted User]PhoenixDownAlecto
  • ddadddad Silver Member Posts: 791
    @2manypasswords
    1 she is doing a lot cooking cleaning and organizing our house with no prompting from me. I struggle to ask her specific requests in those areas because I know it is not something she likes.
    2 we both agree the porn is ancient but it is a marker in our relationship as she has not trusted or believed me since then.
    D
  • SignorePillolaRossaSignorePillolaRossa mid atlantic usaSilver Member Posts: 4,079
    glad you're both here now - it really is a pro marriage site and the anonymity makes it all possible.
    have i missed the part where @dmom has owned up to her failings like @ddad has?
    things won't get better for them nearly as well as they could if only one partner is actively working to improve.

    also, i think it is the wrong mindset to be asking if she is 'ok' with him posting ... he should post exactly as he wants to, when he wants to, what he wants to,  and how he wants to ... if he self censors the timing, content, or tone because he knows she will see it, that is serious DLV - no apologies, ddad! ... yes, of course, talk to her more, but when you're here, be here.
    Sr. PR

    ============================
    sapere aude

    Fuck Culture. Live your life - Beatrice
    ============================
    Angeline[Deleted User]MiddleMan
  • SerenitySerenity Senior Moderator** Posts: 11,358
    @dmom   Welcome.  I am so glad you found your way here.

    I found the Forum first and started posting with my husband's knowledge and with his consent, but not with his enthusiasm. Applying MMSL principles has saved our marriage and we are closer and more connected now after 20+ years of marriage than we were as newlyweds.  I hope the same for you two.

    Some thoughts to keep in mind as the two of you post....

    Anything that will be controversial or upsetting to the other partner needs to be discussed between the two of you *first* before posting. A lot of times, the problem gets ironed out before the first word is typed. The Forum is a great marital tool, but not a place for 'he said....she said'.

    I highly recommend that you read the Mindful Attraction Plan.  It made a huge difference in how my husband and I relate to each other. 
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