GUILT TRIPS!!

Joskin_Nodd

@Hamster_Free:"t's a vintage bug and a standard issue chevy truck."

Then I woulda thought that'd be pretty straight forward. First time I jumped my quasi-Hybrid car, I was a little concerned, because the battery was buried and the places where jumper cables might go were not clear. Even so, I powered through and did it, and had (fortunately) found the right connectors. 

" The house bills have been dropped once or twice, and all it took was a frantic call from his poor, defenseless wife and mother of his two defenseless small children about the toilets that wouldn't flush and no water in the house"

And this dude is getting laid? I'm clearly too prompt about paying my bills.  

Hamster_Free

He wasn't then.  That was before the LAP.

Notelrac

You're not living with a man.  Men overcome adversity.  You're living with a spoiled teenager.  Teenagers whine about how it's not their fault and phone their parents to rescue them and solve the messes they got into.

he called me in a panic 2 minutes before the start of school
What would have happened if you had not answered?  And what would have happened after that?  And after that?  And after that?  Would you have gone home at the end of the day to find that the kids missed school?  Or would he have gotten the kids dressed, fed and to school (although late)?  What if you went away on a business trip for a month?  How would he cope?

No, you're not being shit tested.  You're being taken advantage of.

Angeline

Hamster_Free said:

There's SO much less pressure now that we have dual incomes.  ALL our accounts are separate--our checking accounts are linked, but we can't just go in and take anything out of the others--unless we log in as the account's owner.  We both know how to do that, but haven't out of respect for each other.

If the accounts are linked, then you're still not immune from irresponsible financial decisions - if he overdraws his account, they will likely lock yours until the overdraft is taken care of, if they don't just transfer it out of your account.

And I had some icky flashbacks of the pouty, "you're wrong no matter what" feelings. I said once to a family member that I was so glad to not feel like I was in trouble all the time, and she said "oh hell we all felt that way". Heh. He sounds like a pouty teenager to me, too. The problem with trying to do more, "be more organized", etc. is that you find yourself stretching farther and farther to try and anticipate ANY possible bad outcome. And of course you can't, so then there will be a scene where the whole cascade of crap of the morning is your fault, for failing to anticipate that one piece of it.

Yeeeugh. (shaking self) Gonna go fold some laundry or something to cleanse that outta there.

Serenity

@Dido ;   Americans have an accent?  lol

Dido said:

@Hamster_Free: when the steam is coming out of your ears your American accent is sooo cute.

Serenity

Can you switch budget responsibility to him?

Elaine

The pissy fits remind me of my hubby's low T days.  I know you have mentioned it is a concern.  Have you had it tested yet?  Honestly his irrational behavior is going to continue if low T is the issue.  I was in a very heated argument with my husband about a motorcycle (yep he was also obsessed with purchasing completely impractical and ridiculously expensive "toys" while low T) when he yelled that I had started it.  Like a 4 yr old would say.  You simply can't use logic or convince low T guys of anything.  They are batshit crazy.  As Notelrac pointed out it is not adult behavior. It's like they are teenagers with no common sense and unlimited credit. 

Other than getting the T checked my only advice is to simply look at him and tell him point blank that unless he wants to take charge of the situation to back off.  Anytime he acts like it is your fault tell him that it will either become his responsibility or he can shut up about how you handle it.  My hubby occasionally makes snide comments about how I'm being unreasonably bitchy with the kids.  Usually he has been home for like 5 minutes and has no clue what is even going on. I always stop and think for a minute whether the accusation is justified.  If I really am being ridiculous I shut up and back off, if not I just tell him he can deal with them and walk away.  After doing that a couple times he now only says something if I really am being unreasonable. So I think the easiest way to make people accept responsibility is to remove yourself from the situation and make them handle it alone.

Hamster_Free

@Angeline, it's not that kind of linked.  The accounts are linked only in the fact that the bank is aware that we are married.  He does not have withdraw access on my account, and vice versa, and the only way I've ever found out that he was overdrawn was when he told me (and asked for x amounta bux to cover the disparity).  We have had joint loan accounts where I was a co-signer and got nasty grams about lack of payment, but as soon as I told him I was getting nastygrams, the bill was paid. 

@Serenity, we have divided budget responsibilities.  He pays his bills, I pay mine.  If we're short at the end of the month, we help each other out (yes, I've asked him to cover my shortages too, I'll admit).

@Mandy, he just had his labs done, but..lots of specific details that I can't get into at the moment...mostly, it's military related..I'm not privvy to that information just yet.  I do intend to go over it with him, though.  Concur with letting him handle more responsiblity.  As I mentioned, it's just hard to rewire the brain when my kids are involved. 

UPDATE:

The truck has a new battery (weird, huh?).  He tried to impy that he had to buy a new battery ($150!!)because of me, but I told him (with renewed confidence, thanks, gents!) that 2 hours on a dome light should not have killed a good battery.  He told me that he got it jumped and drove over to the gas station...couldn't get it started again.  Yeah, no.  That's not a good battery.  I told him that I've driven enough beaters in my my poverty stricken youth to know when I've got a perfectly good car with a crappy battery vs a perfectly good battery in a crappy car. 

 

>:D<

Joskin_Nodd

@Purple: "My husband has a tendency to place blame on me, the kids, the dog, the neighbors, or that guy who walked in front of our house two years ago and hasn't been back since... ANYBODY except himself."

Part of the problem is giving very primitive systems for determining the causes of negative circumstances control over our lives. As The Hamster™ doesn't serve us, generally, neither does blame. It gets in the way of solutions. Solutions are never: that guy needs to stop being bad, or "you need to stop being such an asshole" (or, rarely). Blame is also past focused, dredging pointless over the past instead of focusing on the present. "If only you hadn't done this!" is of no value. At all. If he blamed himself for everything, it would not be any better: because it's still the same bad, useless habit, only focused interiorly rather than applied exteriorly. 

Each person needs to take responsibility. Each person needs to be held responsible. If the problem is an animal, be it your own dog or your neighbors, the dog "isn't to blame". And adult human needs to be arranging things so the problem doesn't reoccur. An adult human needs to be responsible. Children need to be held accountable for things appropriate to their age and maturity level . . . but not blamed for the emotional states of their parents. Or held accountable for them. If you know you are supposed to clean your room, and you don't, you are held responsible. If you should know that you ought not throw entire rolls of toilet paper into the toilet, you are held responsible, even if an adult has never told you explicitly not to do that. 

"(its always Christmas's fault that he can't stay on a diet, you know) "

Okay, now, let's not get crazy. It is totally Christmas's fault. And Thanksgiving. Whose bright idea was it to have two food-laden holidays so close together? It's that person's fault. I don't think that's even debatable. :P 

Joskin_Nodd

@Hamster_Free: "" He tried to impy that he had to buy a new battery ($150!!)because of me"

Talk to any professional car mechanic or clerk at an auto store—they will tell you that's nonsense. Draining a car battery (once) would not kill a good battery. How old was the battery? There's no such thing as a "perfectly good" 7 year old car battery. 

Notelrac

"He tried to impy that he had to buy a new battery ($150!!)because of me"
You need to take action on this unhealthy mental behavior of his.  Merely rebutting his Blamer attempts every time is not going to force him to change his underlying behavior.

Hamster_Free

LOL..he's also (in the past) tried to tell me that he doesn't get as good gas mileage when I fill it up with regular vs supreme.  I pulled out the Google and started reading off *multiple* articles--written by folks who should know-- saying that if your car isn't rated above 87, you're wasting your money.  The subject hasn't come up again. 

Don't know how old the battery was.  He bought the truck used about a year ago.  I imagine its the original, considering the age of the truck.

Hamster_Free

"He tried to impy that he had to buy a new battery ($150!!)because of me"
You need to take action on this unhealthy mental behavior of his.  Merely rebutting his Blamer attempts every time is not going to force him to change his underlying behavior.

So, I imagine this sort of thing is resolved through counseling...with him going out of town for a month, that goal is shelved for the moment...but hmm.  In the meantime, I still have to figure out how to get him to go to (not so bad) and *participate* in (darn near impossible) counseling. While I plan to give my best effort in this regard, one common theme I see across these boards is 'you can't force em to change, but you can change yourself', which is a bit discouraging at the outset.

Joskin_Nodd

@Hamster_Free: "LOL..he's also (in the past) tried to tell me that he doesn't get as good gas mileage when I fill it up with regular vs supreme.  I pulled out the Google and started reading off *multiple* articles--written by folks who should know-- saying that if your car isn't rated above 87, you're wasting your money."

Anecdotal experience has indicated to me that even if your car is rated above 87, you don't really get your money's worth. At least, not at any detectable level. Others mileage may vary, quite literally.  

@Notelrac: "You need to take action on this unhealthy mental behavior of his.  Merely rebutting his Blamer attempts every time is not going to force him to change his underlying behavior."

Yup. "Seriously. What in the hell does trying to blame me for the fact that old batteries stop working accomplish? You think that makes our marriage better? Does it make you any happier? Do you think it makes you come off like your smart or capable or manly? Because, sweety, I really don't think it does."

Serenity

@Hamster_Free ;  I'm going to say something a little harsh...not my intent to offend. 

In our past, pre-Capt/FO life, I would try to 'win' arguments with my husband by using logic/data/facts and basically just beating him down with my words. I could almost always get him to concede to my POV. I stopped when I realized I was working at cross-purposes with my goal of getting him to be the Captain in our relationship. In fact, the further we go down this path, the more I realize I did incalcuable damage to the marriage. In a marriage, you can never 'win' an argument because what hurts one...hurts both. The marriage is its own entity and everything you say and do has to be directed at strengthening that entity.

Proving to your husband that he's an idiot damages your marriage, and works against what you want.

That being said, it does sound like he has problems owning up to his responsibilities, so that's an issue that is going to take some work.

Hamster_Free said:

LOL..he's also (in the past) tried to tell me that he doesn't get as good gas mileage when I fill it up with regular vs supreme.  I pulled out the Google and started reading off *multiple* articles--written by folks who should know-- saying that if your car isn't rated above 87, you're wasting your money.  The subject hasn't come up again. 

Hamster_Free

@Serenity, I completely agree with where you're coming from.  Most of the time, if it's not something that matters a whole lot, I won't quibble on the details, and I NEVER undercut his authority/knowledge/strength in front of the kids... but he has chided me a buncha times for filling up *his* truck with 'substandard' fuel.  I felt like I was being talked down to on bad information, so I showed him the good information I was aware of (and which he can easily confirm).  Especially when it's the difference between an $80 fill up and a $100+ fillup and I'm footing the bill.  I coulda just said, Yes dear. and put in whatever I damn well pleased, but it would just come up again in the future.  If that makes him feel like an idiot, it's not my intention, but...it is what it is.

Hamster_Free

@MissusP, It's only when I borrow his truck, which is VERY rarely--no need to go through any of this dance if I don't need to.  Usually doing one of those crap household chores that he (legitimately) isn't available to do, otherwise I'd find a way to frame it as, "it involves your truck, I don't want to be responsible for effing up your truck, you do it."  I don't even keep the spare truck keys on my chain. 

Linanati

@Hamster_Free

My parents are like your husband.  When we (briefly) lived in the same town as them, they at one point blamed my husband and me for my dad's cholesterol going up.  If only we would have lived our lives exactly the way they wanted down to the smallest detail, this wouldn't have happened!  It was the stress caused by us having different opinions!  Therefore we shouldn't have them!  It turned out one of his other medications was interfering with whatever cholesterol-lowering drug he was on, which is what caused his cholesterol to go up.  Of course, they didn't bother apologizing.  That would have been to admit that they were wrong, which would have caused the planets to veer wildly out of orbit.

Our solution to that and other issues was to move several states away from them.  You can't really do that with your husband, especially if you have kids.  Hopefully marriage counseling will help.  Constant blaming and guilting is really difficult to do with, especially since the person doing it usually can't ever admit when they are wrong.  Since everything they do is automatically right, they can't see that the blaming is a problem.

Good luck with this one - you're going to need it.

Joskin_Nodd

@Hamster_Free: "but he has chided me a buncha times for filling up *his* truck with 'substandard' fuel."

The Captain should know what he's talking about. If he doesn't, the FO has a responsibility to provide good intelligence. If the Captain can easily demonstrate that, in fact, he does know exactly what he's talking about, the FO shouldn't keep trying to win that argument, because the Captain has demonstrated he knows what he's talking about. It's that latter part where women tend to beat their husband down with "facts" and logic. And win the battle but lose the war. Once it is clear there is a good reason he says something or is going in some direction, it comes across as you arguing to win the argument, not inform the situation. "Your data is bad! Mine is good! Because it's mine, and I want to be right!" 

Also, Captain's need to have perspective on the broad issues. That is, if the FO is sucking your cock on a regular basis, you really shouldn't give two shits whether or not she fills up your truck with regular instead of high test once in a great while. That's just petty.  

Hamster_Free

Now for a little perspective...

The Guilt Trips are a ROYAL pain in the ass.  And when he's doing them, all the worst things you all say feel true--that DH won't accept responsibility, that I'm overmothering my whole family, that his behavior is reminiscent of a spoiled teenager, etc, etc. 

I'm a little sheepish to confess, though, that this week, he has had days off and is taking the rest of the week off--in order to set the ship as much in order as possible before he goes away for a month.  The angry guilting that he did yesterday is not uncharacteristic, but it has become less common this year, and yes, I mighta over-hamstered a bit yesterday because of accumulation of similar past transgressions--issues that need to be worked out, but which can't be addressed today or tomorrow or next week. 

Basically, I wanted to put out there that despite my ranting, he is making an effort at captaincy at an instintive level, and while he won't pick up MMSL, his basic insticts are strong and he has come a long way--especially this year-- in evolving from his impetuous youth.  The guy is still human, he's stressed out, and he had a shitty morning.  I can appreciate that.  You all have given me some useful tools for keeping up the red pill FO frame when he guilts, which I will tuck away in my rapidly expanding tool box.  I do maintain a hope that with this type of behavior reducing already on its own, that calling him on it will help alleviate it even further.

Will work on counseling when he gets back.  Just giving credit where its due and letting you all know that he's still worth loving.  :^)