@Serenity- A lot of what I've read in the MMSLP and MAP so far talks about how initiating starts earlier in the day. Innuendo, drive-bys, that sort of thing. That's what I'm trying to do. I'm not trying to "sext," I'm trying to be playful. Am I misunderstanding what that means? Should I just give that up?
I'm still trying to find out what works. There's a whole lot that doesn't.
In your own words - "I try to lay some groundwork." Sexting/texting is flirting, not a way to sneak around an actual, in person, scary/risky/ohmyGodshemightsayNO! initiation. You tried to initiate via text.
Sexting, drive-bys, 10 second kisses, flirting - are not a replacement for initiation. They are to remind her that sex exists. I know this is a troublesome concept, but it might make responsive desire make more sense - men have 15? 20? times as much testosterone as women. We just flat aren't thinking about sex to the extent that men are, except possibly at ovulation.
"Speak your truth." - Scarlet Remember to play! Do the right thing, whether anyone is watching or not. Be married, until you are not.
If you want to set the mood, you might try asking how your "naughty" wife is doing, not your "very attractive" wife. Every woman is different, but a hint of unexpected power play in a text can be fun and exciting during the day. Things you are going to do to her when you get home, or can't stop thinking about, things you expect her to wear/cook for you, things you will have to do to her because she has been bad, etc... You can experiment with spelling things out vs. leaving her in suspense by dropping hints. Since all this is new, you may want to add one of these " " after a particularly provocative text, so she knows your intended tone is a fun and sexy one...
Went to my therapy session. Came back. Watched "Modern Family" with my wife, cuddled together on the couch. When the show was over, I carried my sleeping daughter (who my wife had allowed to go to sleep in Mommy and Daddy's bed) back to her room.
My initiation, at about 9:40 PM, went like this:
I go to her, put my arms around her, and say:
Me: How about we...
Wife: [Interrupting] No. I feel crampy....
Me: Oh. We'll try another time. I'm going to go shovel.
Wife: OK.
----
I went and shoveled the driveway. I didn't go to the gym; I wanted to be awake at work today and it was already 10 PM. All in all, I had good OI. Her "No" was as direct and as hard as I've ever seen from her. But I honestly wasn't bothered by it. And she saw that I wasn't bothered by it. So I've got that going for me, which is nice.
She was affectionate this morning, putting her hand on my knee while driving me to the train station. But that's not really anything new. Calendar-wise, we should be in her ovulation window, so her cramps were unexpected for both of us. I'm attributing this to her having stopped BC pills 2 months ago; I'm speculating that her body is still adjusting to that.
After-work social event today; I'm dressed up, making a good DHV. And come hell or high water, I'm going to the gym tonight.
again with the questions. Probably would not have helped the outcome here but asking her for sex is going to lead to more no's. Instead of saying "how about we" try "come here" or "come to bed" etc. Commands, statements. She can still object but get in the habit of being more direct.. also I would push to a hard no. "crampy" is not a hard no. I would have pulled her in close and said something like "you don't feel crampy to me" and then escalate and let her push you away.
At some point in your MAP, when you are making more progress, you will need her to vocalize the hard no so that SHE can't hamster/rationalize that she didn't reject you. It has to stick in her mind that she turned you down for sex, not that she felt crampy etc.
again with the questions. Probably would not have helped the outcome here but asking her for sex is going to lead to more no's. Instead of saying "how about we" try "come here" or "come to bed" etc. Commands, statements. She can still object but get in the habit of being more direct.. also I would push to a hard no. "crampy" is not a hard no. I would have pulled her in close and said something like "you don't feel crampy to me" and then escalate and let her push you away.
At some point in your MAP, when you are making more progress, you will need her to vocalize the hard no so that SHE can't hamster/rationalize that she didn't reject you. It has to stick in her mind that she turned you down for sex, not that she felt crampy etc.
I think this is good advice.
Don't ask, take. Take sex when you want it, until you get a hard no or a physical rejection (i.e., she pushes you away or turns away from you). Obviously we're not talking about forcing yourself on her, but (from experience) the asking just completely kills it. Completely dead.
Can you give me some examples of good, direct initiations that would work at a "beginner" level? That would work at an early-MAP level?
I need to build my confidence and my attractiveness. I honestly don't know how to do this.
I'm interested in replies to this question as well.
Thanks!
Haha. If I knew a good beginner initiation that would work for a guy who is beta and -1 SR to his wife - I wouldn't be on this site and would be a billionaire!
The truth is you are going to get shot down quite a bit. So go into your initiation direct, but expect to get shot down and expect to learn to be totally ice cold OI when you are. Just simple stuff, "come here", "you look delicious" "Mmmmm I have been looking forward to this all day" coupled with action. Kissing, groping, removing clothes.
You don't need anything elaborate you just need to break free from the "hey you wanna" soft stuff. or offers of "back rubs" etc. When you get shot down, be OI, "Married people have sex", "sex is the definition of marriage" if needed, or just shrug and smirk and pat her on the head and say "have a good night dear" and leave the room. Eventually you will want to leave the house but you are a couple of weeks in at this point, you have a lot of ground to cover first, wait until you are in Phase 2 for that stuff.
Phase 1 really blows. You will not get much sex. This is the phase to really focus on you. when you start getting IOI's and her friends start commenting about you, that is when you start to ramp up the initiations, OI and leaving when shot down. Much yet to do.
Thanks, @JasonBourne, those are good ideas that are inside my comfort zone.
@hoping4better, you're right. I chose my words poorly. What I meant was initiations and drive-bys that wouldn't be "too much too soon." I definitely don't expect that there are any magic words that will lead to sex.
For the record, I am not now, nor have I ever been, -1 SR to my wife.
Thanks, @JasonBourne, those are good ideas that are inside my comfort zone.
@hoping4better, you're right. I chose my words poorly. What I meant was initiations and drive-bys that wouldn't be "too much too soon." I definitely don't expect that there are any magic words that will lead to sex.
For the record, I am not now, nor have I ever been, -1 SR to my wife.
According to who? It's SR in HER EYES. Only her eyes.
Maybe you need to look again with her husband goggles on.
Comments
Sexting, drive-bys, 10 second kisses, flirting - are not a replacement for initiation. They are to remind her that sex exists. I know this is a troublesome concept, but it might make responsive desire make more sense - men have 15? 20? times as much testosterone as women. We just flat aren't thinking about sex to the extent that men are, except possibly at ovulation.
Remember to play!
Do the right thing, whether anyone is watching or not.
Be married, until you are not.
Email address: angeline.greenwood@att.net
@middleman
I can tell you this, Keep Working on You, and Your Frame.
I had to Really really Learn this. It is Very counter-intuitive, The More You seem to be affected by her the LESS she gets attracted.
One step at a time HOMIE!
Fate favors the prepared.
Went to my therapy session. Came back. Watched "Modern Family" with my wife, cuddled together on the couch. When the show was over, I carried my sleeping daughter (who my wife had allowed to go to sleep in Mommy and Daddy's bed) back to her room.
My initiation, at about 9:40 PM, went like this:
I go to her, put my arms around her, and say:
Me: How about we...
Wife: [Interrupting] No. I feel crampy....
Me: Oh. We'll try another time. I'm going to go shovel.
Wife: OK.
----
I went and shoveled the driveway. I didn't go to the gym; I wanted to be awake at work today and it was already 10 PM. All in all, I had good OI. Her "No" was as direct and as hard as I've ever seen from her. But I honestly wasn't bothered by it. And she saw that I wasn't bothered by it. So I've got that going for me, which is nice.
She was affectionate this morning, putting her hand on my knee while driving me to the train station. But that's not really anything new. Calendar-wise, we should be in her ovulation window, so her cramps were unexpected for both of us. I'm attributing this to her having stopped BC pills 2 months ago; I'm speculating that her body is still adjusting to that.
After-work social event today; I'm dressed up, making a good DHV. And come hell or high water, I'm going to the gym tonight.
Can you give me some examples of good, direct initiations that would work at a "beginner" level? That would work at an early-MAP level?
I need to build my confidence and my attractiveness. I honestly don't know how to do this.
Thanks, @JasonBourne, those are good ideas that are inside my comfort zone.
@hoping4better, you're right. I chose my words poorly. What I meant was initiations and drive-bys that wouldn't be "too much too soon." I definitely don't expect that there are any magic words that will lead to sex.
For the record, I am not now, nor have I ever been, -1 SR to my wife.
I hear and understand what you're saying, @hoping4better. And I will keep this in mind.